Just curious. I get the feeling the majority of the users on this sub are either outright atheist, or 'support Christianity as a bedrock of Western Civilization, but don't really believe it' agnostic/atheist. Feel free not to answer if you don't want to reveal that about yourself, just a thought I had.
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Was an atheist in HS and have made the slow journey into the worship of Jesus Christ into my 40's.
+1
I don’t believe in god but Christian’s make the best civilizations.
This is where I am. Taking my child to church and holding my tongue because I can't deny that the spread of outcomes is better.
There are some really important lessons I learned from the bible that my parents should have taught me and did not.
The first of these is that the choice of partner is the most important decision I will ever make. Vastly more important than buying a house, which is a 30 year commitment in this market.
Another is that the purpose of marriage is so that children can have fathers. No more and no less. Without marriage kids don't have dads, and that is very, very bad for kids.
Third is that a good wife is a support system for her husband. She enables him to commit himself to his duties as a husband and father and optimize his behavior for productivity. This is often selfless and self sacrificing behavior for the wife, and it certainly isn't glamorous; but a wife's first priority should be the marriage and her second priority should be her husband. This is reciprocated. A good husband sacrifices for his family every single day.
None of this was in evidence with my family. None. My mother actively prevented me from learning the tells and behaviors of a high-quality woman, which turned out about how you would expect for me.
Kids do not understand the importance of relationships. The media etc. are constantly selling them the message that sex is meaningless. This really, really isn't true. Sex is terrifyingly powerful and should remain sacred for both men and women.
Thirded.
People who sincerely behave in the way that the Bible tells them to just seem to lead better lives than those who don't.
Some Eastern religions also seem to produce decent civilizations, but I'd never want to live there with the whole reincarnation cycle and strict caste and complete lack of value of "lower" human life.
Christian civilizations are the only civilizations atheists can live in without being murdered by the government, including atheist civilizations.
It honestly doesn't matter if God exists or not. I'll give you a case study.
There are two cars. One is fitted with Star Trek Shields and Inertial Dampeners etc. It is invulnerable to collisions. The other is wired with denotator switches and has a claymore mine mounted in the middle of the steering wheel. The slightest tap on another car will detonate the mine.
People will drive these cars differently.
People will also drive these cars differently if they believe the cars are so equipped. If the Star Trek stuff is fake and the Claymore mine is fake, the change in behavior will still occur as long as they remain convinced.
Christians believe in accountability. There is a man with a beard in the clouds writing down everything they do. At some point after they die they will have to face an account of their actions and decisions. Not only that, it is spelled out in very clearly what attitudes, behaviors, and actions are expected of them. They include: Submission to the Universe (the will of God), The practice of gratitude, honesty with all people, including self-honesty, forgiveness of the past rather than holding grudges, and to value sacrifice.
Even if there is no God or our understanding of god is wrong, Christianity is still the most useful belief matrix through which to view the world; especially from a community level.
I'll tell you something, women raised in a strong Christian tradition make much better wives. It isn't a magic cure for the flaws of women, but they are much more likely to be a virgin and to take their marriage seriously as a commitment made before god. That said, most western woman worship at the alter of feminism, no matter which church they attend, and so does their support group.
Christianity isn't perfect, but it is a quantum leap forward from the predecessor Judaism, which seems to be optimized for preserving tribal values and leads (fairly directly) to tribalism rather than integration.
Finally: Here is one for you.
Jews believe that religious practice is more important than faith. First you practice the ceremonies and values of Judaism, then as you grow older faith will follow. This is even more valid for Christians, especially if you are raising a family.
I believe in god more than I believe man's machinations of god.
I'm 41 and was an Atheist for 25 years up until about three years ago when I saw the fruits of Atheism, decided it was gay and cringe, and then turned my life around. I was converted through a variety of reasons but the fruits spoke for themselves.
This is basically where I'm at. Worshiping the "le SCIENCE!!!!" gave us "women have penises and men get pregnant"
Christian. Used to have my own church but it went lefty during COVID. I have moved around for work twice the last three years so still don't have a church I call my own right now. One I went to a couple times.
I was raised Protestant, but I have been to an Orthodox church with a friend and have watched both Latin Mass Roman Catholic Church and Russian Orthodox Church services online.
Missouri Lutheran Synod is still fairly based. Russian Orthodox as well (Greek is beginning to be infiltrated by globohomo). Mainstream (Novus Ordo) Catholicism is completely retarded and gay but FSSP and SSPX are still solid.
Just be aware that Catholicism is an inferior branch of Christianity, from a historical and sociological perspective. We can discuss why if you care.
But I'll point out that South America was settled by Catholics, and Catholicism is the dominant faith. They are poor as shit, despite having about the same distribution of natural resources as the USA.
The USA was settled by Protestants and is, comparatively, rich and peaceful.
IMNHO it is largely the Spanish influence on the Catholic faith. I will discuss why, if you care.
I’m a Christian. Was raised going to church and never stopped believing
I'm not sure of the exact makeup here, but I know we've got a fair number of Christians for sure. Probably more than atheists/agnostics. I know there are definitely some atheists, but I think they're a minority. But I could be wrong, so I definitely hope people weigh in here and give us an idea of actual representation of each group.
As for me, I grew up an, and I'm not a big fan of the terminology but, "agnostic theist." I always believed in God, but I wasn't sure if anyone was ultimately out there or not. Eventually, and I don't know what prompted it, but I realized that I couldn't imagine there not being a God, actually.
So, I'm still non-religious - that might change someday, I certainly flirt with it from time to time - but I definitely believe in God.
That would technically be "nonbeliever" more than anything I think.
I think the term agnostic means "without knowledge" ... it sounds like that doesn't apply to you at all my friend! Be Well!!
Agnostics believe that proof is impossible within this world.
While they are correct, it misses the point. It doesn't matter if there is a God. It does matter if we carry our burdens and strive to make the world better using guiding principles. Both require faith.
Nations founded on Protestant principles are more peaceful and more prosperous. You can compare that to godless faiths like Marxism and Feminism. Both which destroy civilization.
Started life agnostic as just couldn't stand organised religion, became more atheistic simply due to my mindset.
That being said, I FULLY understand this is something that can't be applied more than to individual cases. The majority need structure that only an organised faith can provide otherwise they go degenerate.
Not me. Jesus Christ all the way. God is real, and God is great, and God is good.
Deus Vault!
I'm Christian, but I was never that much into reddit to begin with. It feels like the more you used that site, the more likely you were to be an atheist.
Reddit actively bans actual Christians and only allows atheists in disguise to remain, so you are correct.
Christ is King
Hate speech according to the ADL
But advertising the Aloha Snack Bar isn't?
I've been a believer since I was a child, though I went through the prerequisite "I don't know if we can prove it" era as a teen.
I've struggled to maintain it, in both the face of my own personal life's horrors and the overwhelming despair of the world, but I find that if you've never had that struggle you don't truly believe.
James 1:2-4 NASB95 — Consider it all joy, my brethren, when you encounter various trials, knowing that the testing of your faith produces endurance. And let endurance have its perfect result, so that you may be perfect and complete, lacking in nothing.
Over the years I realized most people need a strong religion to guide them. And when Catholicism was abandonned in my nation, pseudo-Science, TV news and Government replaced that.
And those turned out to be worse for my people than Catholicism ( which had its flaws and bad actors ).
I don't care, aka apatheist, but regardless it's pretty obvious which group plays nice the most in general and with others, and which others attempt subjugation and/or extermination when able.
I don't know what I am anymore. Maybe a Christian without faith and without a church I feel at home in.
Whats going on?
Sedevacantist Traditionalist Catholic. All y'all are heretics lol.
How far back do you go? In terms of when was the last pope?
At least to the Second Vatican Council and the removal of Latin Mass. Even then the signs of "current year" were creeping in. The Church is the Church because it's not supposed to change to try and be trendy.
I believe that
we're in a simulation, because everything I learn about quantum is exactly how I would code a lazy evaluation approximation of a real universe.
we're mathematical like some sort of 3d time fractal. The big bang, universe expansion, black holes etc seem analogous to the number line, irrational numbers and so on.
we're incapable being inside the system of ever knowing how or why anything is here.
Basically I'm a Pascal Wagerist, except not Christian-centric - we can't know, if you can believe you'll be happier, but don't get all worked up about it. Live a good life as part of the world not vs the world.
Fun thought experiment: consider that it's the other way around. Our current understanding of subatomic physics is informed by the way we would code lazy approximation. The same way that every man who tries to implement flight from scratch starts with a device that flaps. We just don't perceive how the world at that scale primed our advancement. The universe led us to code that way.
What we see is only a fraction of what is. Our brains are not capable of perceiving the raw energy that is flowing around us all the time.
I dont think we live in a simulation, it just appears that way because the universe has to manifest itself somehow.
And even if we did, it still wouldnt really matter, in the end we are still the universe experiencing itself.
There was one somewhat credible theory that space doesn't even exist, that everything is a graph. So there's no spooky action at a distance because the entangled parts are right next to each other in the graph even if they are far away in 'space'.
If it's something like that we may never be able to figure out what's truly going on.
Sounds like a kind of Gnosticism. Possibly aided by hallucinogenics along the way (not judging if so)
Statistically speaking, we will continue to develop technology at SOME level of pacing.
That technology will eventually reach reality-simulation level, to simulate some war game or long-term planning project.
That simulation technology will reach eventual perfect complexity: Imagine a Minecraft map using redstone to run Minecraft. Perfectly technically possible. Just, grander scale.
We can thus logically deduce that in a simulation meant to pass the simulation point, there is/was/will-be an infinite amount of simulations both up and downstream of us.
EXCEPT...
We can reasonably assume we're in an entirely pre-scripted simulation, but likewise, there exists a chance we aren't and we can reasonably act as if we aren't, because if we aren't that is correct, but if we are, it's all pre-scripted anyways so that action of assuming it wasn't pre-scripted was already presupposed and taken into calculation, and could be an important part of the simulation's process.
The only problem with the simulation hypothesis is that it's unlikely that we're aliens wearing a TentacleVR hat and when our human character dies we take it off and go about our alien day.
It's very likely that the simulators don't even know we exist, or even that life exists, in their simulation. They're simulating universes with different constants or something like that.
That's why I don't like these attempts to do insane computations with quantum. If they can actually do classical computations that would take longer than the universe then maybe we crash the simulator or they restart it to fix the glitch.
Christian here. Raised Methodist, but not sure what I technically am now in this modern era of eroding values and subverted churches. I just know that Jesus is Lord, and following Him is the best way to take care of yourself and your neighbors.
I'm an atheist and as long as that remains true I won't have any problem with Christianity (as long as it's not one of those "ankle is porn censor everything" or the "burn everyone that disagrees" types)
I do not believe in God but I don't think most people can handle being atheist and so they instead join these cults that worship something else in pursuit of filling the religious hole that was left behind.
Raised Christian, pretty conservative Protestant. Fell off but never claimed atheism. Fully claim Christianity now, came to realize there must be something to the fact that the world I want is the world described in the Bible. Don’t go to church, not sure I ever go back to where I came. They were too much “church of God is trying to send you to hell on a technicality”. I mean I hate the church of everyone sin constantly because Jesus loves you, but it can go the wrong way the other too.
Greasy grace is a turn off for sure. What do you think following Jesus means?
Protestant Christian. Been a wild ride watching Gamergate go from technoliberal atheism to people getting downvoted for disrespecting the Bible.
I think the world can be broken down between people who love true beauty and people who are inured to it. Those in the former camp are drawn inexorably to standards, which can only come from God. So I knew this was coming, and I'm happy about it.
It is hilarious, but it's also a great show of the power of faith in the modern world that 10 years ago some of the people who only cared about cooming to big booba 2d females in games and anime are now devout Christians. Mysterious ways indeed.
I lost my faith 2 decades ago, until my 12 yr old son convinced me to attend church again with him and my parents.
I was baptized along with him and my daughter last month. Jesus is the Way and the Truth.
Welcome back Brother. I'll see you on the streets of Glory someday. It's gonna be a blast.
I'm a cradle Catholic. I've had ebbs and flows in my level of belief. But I've always felt attached to the Church and it's a binding force in my family. I usually separate atheist and people who don't believe in God. Because I've found there is a vegan level of zealotry in a certain section of atheist.
I was raised Catholic, later became an atheist and skeptic, and after decades of exploring different perspectives, I developed my own teleological framework. I realized that science, eastern/western religions, philosophy, and mysticism were like the fable of the five blind men touching an elephant (each grasping part of the truth but missing the whole). So, I streamlined everything into a unified metaphysical model that connects it all. After finishing my model, I came across a mystic phrase that fully resonates with my ideas and explains part of them in an elegant way: "As above, so below; as within, so without; as the universe, so the soul."
It's been quite a ride.
I’m a Cultural Christian just like non-religious Jews still identify as secular Jews.
I was raised Christian, my blood is Christian, my ancestors, my homeland, etc. Christianity is an essential component to what separates Western culture and civilization from the rest of the world, and makes it exceptional. Christian culture and way of life should be compulsory, even if deep down you don’t believe the supernatural parts.
But I’m still atheist… not by choice really, but by inescapable conclusion based on all the information I’ve digested over the years.
I could say I’m not an atheist, but I’d be lying to myself. I don’t want to be an atheist.
Atheist here.
I'm an atheist but not a militant one like I used to be.
so athiest, not antithiest?
just trying to pin it down.
You're thinking of Gizortnik.
not thinking of anyone in particular, lol. I'm just trying to make sure I understand.
Yeah, I'm not an antitheist per se, but I don't think the claims made by the religious are valid with the level of proof they provide
well, i can understand and respect that.
my biggest problem is with antitheists, not because they're necessarily bad people, some are no doubt very well meaning people, but because so many of them are almost religiously(ironic) opposed to even the suggestion that there may be some validity to faith, to the point that they're insufferable to be around.
seriously, i knew a guy who would snap an angry retort even if you even quipped that 'there is a god."
I'm a non-denominational Christian; Jesus Christ has been my Lord for almost my whole life. My parents raised me on Christianity, and when I became an adult I chose to stay with it because it just made a lot of things fit in my mind, and because I was inspired by the deeds of other Christians (A tree is known by its fruit, and I think even many non-believers will acknowledge that).
Though sometimes I get so frustrated with the evils in this world that I'll use this account to vent. As much as I want to see earthly justice come to people, I want so much more to see them repent and serve the Lord for the sake of their souls and to inspire others that they may be saved too.
"support Christianity as a bedrock of Western Civilization, but don't really believe it" here.
I am irreligious. I don't subscribe to labels to describe myself. A lot of people do think that morals are only compatible with being religious but I don't agree.
Of course not, people can be good because they want to be.
Is that how it always plays out, no, we are human beings and by our nature flawed, but that doesnt mean we cant try to do better than the day before.
I was raised without religion. Grew up fairly militantly anti-theist, think Atheist with a 'hell is immoral infinite punishment for finite crimes' chip on his shoulder.
Took the Mormons to bring me to Christ; their theology defines hell as the distancing from the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost. The outer darkness, where even the Spirit cannot comfort you is hell.
Now that I believe, I am in a place where judgement seems wise and necessary. Still not sure about our visions of the afterlife, mind you, but more agnostic on that front than judgmental at this point. I like to think of it as learning enough of the mystery to know that I cannot know.
Still leaves me a heretic in the eyes of most of Christianity, though. There's little denying that the Latter Day Saints are a 'Cult for Christ.' Whether this makes them false prophets or just another revivalist sect is an open question to my mind. Especially since it's abundantly clear that Joseph Smith himself was a flawed charismatic preacher, who was 'touched' in ways that would land him in a psych ward today. I settle for judging them by their fruits. They're good people who I am happy to number myself among.
(This isn't to say my journey is over, spiritually speaking. I feel like due diligence as regards mainline Christianity is in order. Specifically, the Eastern Rite Roman Catholicism my late Aunt earnestly suggested I explore, the Irish Catholicism of my Maternal Grandfather, and the Eastern Orthodox faith which I find Mormonism uniquely unsuited to critique.)
My grandparents were deeply religious, so were most of my ancestors (part of the quaker movement). My dad was a hippy and didnt really buy into god so grew up believing his own thing.
He told us to believe in what we felt was real and to discover that on our own. One of my siblings ended up going to church every wed, sunday, getting involved with the community, etc, the whole 9 yards.
I am envious of this, I truly am. When I tell them this, they get offended like I am making fun of them or something.
I want to believe, so I would subscribe as a agnostic. Basically what my dad thought.
I believe there is something more, is it some singular entity in the clouds judging me for every decision I made in my life. I dont think it works like that.
Telling me im going to hell for not believing doesnt sound right either.
I think the phrase, that god exists in all of us makes sense. And that perhaps someone did walk this earth saying that and telling us we have to love each other. Thats the only way forward as a species, what we have is a path of self destruction.
I suppose im pretty close to finding out the truth now. Everyday is a struggle with the parathyroid.
What I seek is a explanation that unites all religions, and the ancient aliens does that. The bible does appear to be a curated collection of much older, more ancient stories.
Which eastern rite out of curiosity?
I have since asked my father about my aunt's journey through Catholicism. Here's what I learned:
According to him, our family were Ukrainian members of the Catholic Church at the time of the schism. This means they chose the Pope over the Patriarch of Constantinople. This made them practicing Roman Catholics, with a dispensation to conduct Byzantine Rites; members of the Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church.
My Grandfather was a member of St. George's in NYC. (You can see from the website, that the church continues to worship and communicate primarily in Ukrainian.) The Ukrainian language was presumed.
My father (and my aunt) attended St. George's parochial school & services-- while not being fluent. As second generation Americans, they never learned Ukrainian. This caused them both considerable angst, as their peers were recent immigrants, or 1st generation Ukrainians-- all of whom spoke Ukrainian as their primary language, if not being bi-lingual.
My Aunt changed churches (but not communions) when she moved upstate, choosing a mainline Roman Catholic church, where her interest in the Eastern Rite (due to our family heritage) saw the introduction of Eastern Iconography to her parish, which had many parishioners of Eastern European ancestry.
Hey, thanks for sharing.
I have a catholic bias and want you to join us of course. And I have a bias towards the older more traditional stuff. So I think your Aunt might have been onto something. But yeah, I encourage you to keep doing your due diligence as you described and will pray for you.
Thanks.
Catholicism has been a pillar of the Western Tradition. I find it hard to argue with the faith of Tolkien and the 'men of the West.' Philosophically, even though Descartes drove me up the wall, I find myself forced to re-examine and duplicate his process. For, as Pascal suggested, there's nothing to lose and eternity to gain.
Again-- (as ever) I have to judge the tree by its fruits.
Ukrainian. The family in the old country were Catholics, as far as I know.
I think I'm too materialist to truly believe in God. I was raised Lutheran, but never really felt interested in the church. I tried to make myself enjoy it and believe it, but it didn't work. I stopped attending church and Sunday School in my later teens and never returned. I had my Atheist "phase" where the core of my stance was along the lines of "if God is there, he'll call me back." I don't think I have ever felt that call, but I became so disgusted with the anti-Theism of the people online that I stopped calling myself Atheist. I am a lost sheep with nowhere to call home.
I have extreme difficulty believing in things that I cannot see or touch. I want so desperately to believe in "magic" things like God, or ghosts, or the occult, but because I never see it with my own eyes, or experience it despite my disbelief, I cannot truly believe in it. I refuse to pretend for the sake of appearances, either, because I would know that I was lying to myself 100% of the time. I can lie to myself about doing my laundry or exercise later, but nothing so important as a core belief system.
I have enjoyed a large number of coincidences, synchronicities, and lucky breaks in my life, but they're otherwise so mundane that I think it would be insulting to try to attribute them to God's intervention. I love organ music, and have a fair few "religious" songs and outright hymns on my regular music playlist(1)(2)(3)(4)(5)(6)(7). I have memorized a couple prayers in Latin because I am an aspiring polyglot and being able to recite Latin prayers is a neat party trick (I do not attend parties, or any other social functions for that matter). The church has left an impact on me that is markedly more positive than negative, but I refuse to go through the motions with no soul behind them.
God likes the material too. He made it and called it good. Keep up with the polyglot hobby. God made all those too, and they are fascinating and fun! What other languages are you working on?
God is speaking to you in many ways... its the hearing that comes harder. 'Those with ears to hear will hear' The mundane occurs as a subset of God's ability to interact with us. 'The heavens declare the glory of God, and the skies proclaim his handiwork' Even the mundane speaks. Can you hear it?
I have this weird liking for christian pop-punk music. Like relient k, eleventyseven.
I never really attributed that to god either lol. But yeah Im the same as you, ive never seen a angel or heard god speak, so its hard to just take the word of a book on it.
Oh shit this has me dying.
https://chvnradio.com/articles/relient-k-apologizes-for-20-year-old-song
I used to love Reliant K. That's really disappointing they cucked out like that and apologized for a funny, harmless, and accurate song about women. It's disgusting that so many on the Right are so weak and pathetic that even the most mild tongue in cheek criticism of women is something they think they need to prostrate themselves and apologize for.
The sad fact is that a great deal among the ostensible Christian Right don't worship God, but in fact worship women.
Raised quaker, wasn't sure for a while, increasingly self-admittedly bad quaker.
GenX/Millennial media addled Gnostic/Pagan heretic. I'm apprehensive about using the label because of the new-age whackos that morphed into a core segment of today's superficial, gynocentric hysteric left-leaning society. These hugboxing loons don't stop to ponder that priomordial Woman is partially responsible for original sin, as in mainstream Christianity. There's also the older usage of Gnostic as a byword for two-faced conspiratorial arrogance. To me, it is merely a heterodox exploration of metaphysics.
When asked, I just say nondenominational Christian or Neo-Platonist, and I avoid the confusion of the other person hearing 'agnostic'. If the other is familiar, I have no desire to discuss whether he serves Yaldabaoth, like we're having a fanboy flamewar over football teams or gaming consoles. Good Christians (or any other religion) serve the highest god of our universe through virtue.
I'm not what I'd call a Christian, although I pray in church occasionally. Raised Catholic. Abandoned it in favour of pseudo-nihilist, Nietzschean outlook (I've never read Nietzsche, but anyone can figure his shit out intuitively). Recently, I solved all nihilist impulses through thorough self-reflection, inspired by the ever-shifting epistemologies of the covid pandemic and some philosophical reading. Self-preservation, fear, loneliness.... these did not factor in.
I think perhaps Christianity doesn't tell the full tale of human consciousness but it tells a fuller tale than secular 'rational' materialism. I have some disdain for the idea of utilitarian Christianity - as in, 'we need it because think of the alternative' - but maybe that's because I have extreme disdain for utilitarianism in general.
I'm not devout, nor atheist nor one of Dawkins 'cultural Christians', but I do pray to Christ sometimes.