Man, libertarians have been really showing thier ass lately
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NewsFlash: libertarianism only works in a moral, educated and homogenous population. We have none of those things right now. Going to bat for your enemies isn't principles, it's suicidal autism
Every system works under those circumstances.
Yeah the system itself is much less important than the people within it.
Nah man, it's the magic dirt. But the dirt also magically decays at the exact same time diversity is forced onto the population. Coincidentally. It's definitely the magic dirt.
Wrong. A socialist/communist system does not work under any circumstances because markets are too large and varied for any person to manage.
And yet Whites survived those systems. Whites are getting wiped out under capitalism.
Millions dead under communism, whites still putting up a fight under "capitalism". I know which I prefer
Ah, yes, the economic sterilization doesn't count as deaths argument. After all, if they were never born they can't die.
Yea, they are fetuses all along not people. This guy gets it! I’d love kids but can’t afford anymore and my wife doesn’t have the time. I love my black neighbor shandra who has 8 kids and doesn’t seem to work at all. Wonder how she manages it!
No it doesn't, not on the same level that communication killed. We can come back from "economic sterilization" easily.
Thanks for reminding me. Here are some photos of the "oppressive communist hell" of Moscow in the 1950s. Safe, clean, orderly, homogenously White, everyone looking well dressed, healthy and happy.
And here is America at the same time. This is in rural Arkansas, mind, during the supposed "golden age" when armed men are forcing Whites to intermingle with violent subsaharan apes.
Now tell me which one is the truly tyrannical regime.
Communism, you brain-worm ridden faggot. You literally compared the countries capital to a city going through turmoil. Post pictures of Washington DC at that time, you'll get similar results.
Communism doesn't work in theory or in practice. I get you guys are emotionally stunted and can only communicate in edginess, but at least try to put some thought into your post next time.
DC was even worse. And in ten more years would be unrecognizable due to the shitshow of the 60s. "Thanks" (((LBJ))) for the welfare state, affirmative action, "urban renewal" and unlimited turd world migration (the Gun Control Act would soon follow further crippling Whites' ability to defend ourselves from the results of forced miscegenation, and the government that enabled it).
I picked a "baste red state" on purpose. This was happening in the "heartland" of "the land of the free." Demographics are destiny and the rest is details.
(((Capitalism))) is a race to the bottom. There will always be hordes of semi-literate apes willing to undercut fair wages with slave labor.
Look up the Icelandic free states period. Its pretty libertarian.
waow
Yes, and its an interesting period that people should read about
If you had a libertarian democracy, then millions of illegals would enter tomorrow and vote themselves a sharia theocracy with all your stuff given away as a jizyah
This is why although I've said I lean heavily towards Libertarianism (because in reality I'm more aligned with Lockean Liberalism which could be confused with Libertarianism); I'm really more of a Militarist Minarchist.
A moral, educated, and homogenous population isn't enough. You need complete armamentation, and a marshal society. Really, even outside of Liberal philosophy, the only societies that ever respected individual rights and liberties were societies where the population was trained, equipped, and on-call for military service. Effectively, such societies had governments that accepted that autocracy couldn't work, and that they could quickly end up being executed by the general population that was also their army. As such, it made a hell of a lot more sense to betray no one, and keep the soldiering population happy with reasonable governance. State craft was also better because it meant that the political leadership was also the officer corps and only got that way through trust from subordinates, agreeableness with higher-ups, and competence of command. Before America, we only ever really saw this in England, Switzerland, and the Sikh Confederation.
If everyone is capable of serving with one another in a military capacity, you've just achieved the morality, education, and homogeneity that you're looking for; but now you can actually use it.
Basically renaming globalism as "free trade"
Libertarians are retarded. I figured that out in 2016.
I voted for Gary Johnson in 2016 only because I hoped the contentiousness of Trump and Hillary would have split the vote between the Lolberts and the Greens enough to get past the 10% point so future elections wouldn't just be between a Giant Douche and a Turd Sandwich (make it a four way with a Giant Turd and a Douche Sandwich).
And now all you see about either of those parties is people trashing them, making broad unrealistic generalizations about them, etc
Ensuring that we’ll never have more than two parties.
Totally natural and coincidental
One party, the gay zionists.
Me too. Then, suddenly, I was hated by everyone and I stopped talking to people about politics IRL.
DMing an e-girl for nudes is more likely to have the desired effect than vooting.
Dave Smith and his pet Robbie are having a small meltdown over this Jew who got himself shot right now.
They make the argument that simply carrying a gun is not illegal, and on principle I do agree.
However, there are a couple things that make this situation not as cut and dry as "omg the stasi shot him for no reason"
One: as a conceal carry owner, he should have been aware that you don't try to deliberately get into conflicts knowing you are carrying. The whole point is that it is a defensive measure, not an offensive one.
Two: the people he interfered with weren't some random civilians harassing and possibly injuring another civilian, they were law enforcement officers, Federal ones no less. LEO have more rights than normal citizens, and while I don't think that they should, I live in the real world and in the real world civilians are second class citizens. What he was doing was impeding and interfering with feds, which has been illegal since basically forever.
Three: the gun in question that the guy had was a Sig P320 according to the information we have. That gun is notorious for being one of the only modern firearms that is capable of firing spontaneously. There is documented evidence of those guns randomly going off in peoples holsters, and even just sitting on a table, and people have been injured because of it.
There is a very real possibility that the gun randomly went off and the ICE officers thought they were being shot at by this guy. He turned an already tense situation into a lethal one by deliberately inserting himself into it while armed with a defective weapon. He is at least 90% to blame for his own death.
Having said this, it is still a major fuckup by ICE that this guy got killed. They didn't handle him as well as they could have, and they made a split second reaction that resulted in him being killed. This has handed the left a major win, because normie centrist retards are sensitive to shit like this, and the left can spin this as a dictator murdering citizens instead of what it actually was: a paid agitator deliberately interfering with ICE agents.
I don’t care if ICE fucked up. These people absolutely deserve it.
And they won't stop unless there's actual consequences to the shit they've been doing their whole lives.
I'm not sure of the legality of this (depends on the jurisdiction, no doubt) but this isn't quite right, philosophically speaking.
It's not that they have more rights, it's that they have more responsibilities. It's their duty to uphold the law and therefore they can act as though defending themselves while they are defending the law.
In this case, a normal citizen would have been charged with murder; there's no case to be made for self-defense at all. However, the guy got shot while actively impeding the enforcement of a law so, even though the situation could have been resolved without him getting shot, the cops are not liable for the results of his fucking around.
LEOs don't have any of the 2nd amendment restrictions that normal citizens have. They quite literally have more rights than you do just by that alone.
If only there were some way that guy could have not been in that situation.
Instead he went out the FAGS way: Fuck Around & Get Shot.
Also, he broke a rib the week before pulling a similar stunt.
“Get your fist out of my wallet and into my butt.” ~ libertarian proverb
Kek
You forgot the part where they shoehorn in the age of consent.
And like drugs man
And the draft.
Like many young men, I considered myself a libertarian for more than a few years. I read Ayn Rand, Mises, Hayek, and Schumpeter. I believed in individual responsibility, individual accountability, and individual rights. I believed in a small government, "social liberal, economic conservative," and all the other tripe.
It's all horseshit that relies on a small, educated, homogenous populace with a core set of shared values.
Impossible, in other words.
Today I don't consider myself a libertarian, a republican, or a conservative.
I'm an anti-leftist.
It's fine as a personal philosophy, it's terrible as political theory.
That's actually my stance, as mostly a libertarian.
Libertarianism is great as an ideal, not great as an answer to the problems that plague us. It has too many holes when it comes to gatekeeping. You need some level of nationalism, tribalism, protectionism, and even collectivism and racism, if you care about protecting an identity/people/country/values.
While some libertarians are capable of embracing those things, very few embrace all of them at the same time...and the movement in aggregate certainly doesn't.
If you can't identity what it is you want to protect, you're vulnerable to letting bad actors in to victimize you by using your own ideals against you and your people. "Individualism," while a good ideal, is not a good system to actually protect the freedom we all care about.
No Hoppe?
I believe I did, though I couldn't tell you what. I've never been that interested in the more philosophical stuff. I enjoyed Ayn Rand as it was easy (but long), and I think "Road to Serfdom" was the other book I remember strongly.
My "politics" can be summed up by the 14 Words.
This necessarily means enmity with another group as it just so happens kappa
When leftists are in power, libertarians oppose the government and fail.
When conservatives are in power, libertarians oppose the government and succeed.
Retards.
I mean, I think that illustrates the problem with so called conservatives, not the libertarians.
The Republicans don't want to win.
The point is that libertarians can reliably sabotage a thin conservative majority but are powerless to stop a thin leftist majority.
I'm prepared for my downvotes.
A ton of libertarians are making very good points, and deservedly calling out the admin for their terrible stances. The "conservative" position is that if you're carrying a gun and magazines, you're a terrorist. If you film feds, you're a terrorist. If you interact with feds while armed, you deserve to die.
I see a lot of people drawing comparisons between this and Ruby Ridge, or the Bundy standoff. You can say the admin is just misspeaking, but it's still troubling seeing so many conservatives getting on board with speech that would justify the execution of the Bundy boys and the like.
You can be anti-leftist, anti-agitator, anti-communist...and also against the government lying about an American they just killed.
A ton of conservatives are being absolutely fucking retarded.
The Admin response, particularly Kash's, has been embarrassing. All they had to do is come out and say, "he was killed in the commission of a federal felony assault on an officer while impeding law enforcement operations. We will investigate the situation but initial reports show that the officers' response was reasonable given the situation that Pretti and the rioters in general have created."
100%
Pajeet Patel, Fag Bongino, and Pam Blondie are fucking killing us.
Yup.
Even if you don't agree with the statement, it's a much more defensible/reasonable, and much less retarded stance by a mile.
Like their faggot prophet Alinsky said: Make the enemy live up to its own book of rules.
90% chance the feds messed up here and killed this guy after NDing his Sig (I mean, after the Sig NDed itself). If that turns out to be true, the agents should be censured with appropriate penalties.
At the same time, the guy took an unnecessary risk and the worst ended up happening.
Mistakes happen. It should be cleaned up and we should move on. You have the right to the Second Amendment at a protest but if you insist on wrestling the feds at the same time then someone is eventually going to get hurt. Either you, a fed, or some bystander.
I mean, people don't deserve to die because they go underwater cave diving, but it happens sometimes.
Yup. A lot of people are being so tribal they act like if you condemn the government, you like Alex Pretti and think he did nothing wrong. He was a shitty communist who was a bit of a jackass. The killing was still likely unjustified (in my opinion), and the narrative after the fact is definitely disgusting.
Both can be true. I'm not on Pretti's "side" or anything. Alex Fucked Around, Found Out. The feds Fucked Up.
I agree with you but I will say I have extreme “protester fatigue”. Sick of these morons injecting themselves into these situations and getting treated like heroes but. As you say it was a major screw up by ICE. I would just love to ask them why they are so eager to protect the murderers, rapists, etc that they are there to arrest. Similar issues I had with the blm scum and the zombies who protested over Floyd. I was like if you want to protest black ppl getting killed then march your butt to these inner cities but no.
Oh, I get it. They're being absolutely vile jackasses, often state-sponsored. The Dem establishment is knee-deep in this, and the leftist rioters are often to the state of terrorism.
What they've done to innocent people, citizen journalists, and feds (including off duty) has been really disgusting. You won't find me defending them; they want war, they want more violence, and they'd actually love it if ICE/fedbois killed more protestors. They want martyrs.
I completely condemn the leftists. I also want the feds to be much better trained if they're being sent out into that, and I want the admin to have an actual conservative response as well, and not come off like Dems themselves.
Yep, I can agree with that. Also they need to understand that the leftist absolutely want a martyr. I feel there will be less enforcement. They keep pointing to Obama being able to deport but he didn’t have a hostile media and I don’t remember these morons obstructing ICE arrests
Devon mentioned it a few streams back. How we gotta be dancing on the graves of our enemies, the protesters, because they would have danced on ours. We do that, we deny them the victimhood.
There's something very satisfying about the idea of joining ICE because it's the only socially acceptable way to backhand a suburban liberal boomer Karen right in her yappy fucking mouth.
I don't blame them, so many conservatives get dogged for fighting on principle while the other side wins with friend/enemy distinction.
I get it.
But you've still got a lot of "based conservatives" saying things that are completely believable of coming out of the mouths of the most insufferable of shitlibs.
The admin's strategy has been to invoke Schmitttian friend/enemy distinction by tapping into the frustrations of years of political neglect. The problem is, the admin is just another arm of ZOG that wants infinite browns in the country. They are just another enemy. They're trying to blur friend/enemy distinction and hope to mask their intent by leaning into a tribalism. Not having principles is the point.
Anyone comparing a paid agitator getting engoodified to Ruby fucking Ridge should also get engoodified.
Huh. I guess there's speech I'm against after all.
Violence is always right
But only if you use enough
The Libertarian Party is a joke, even to Libertarians.
Libertarians never could decide amongst themselves if they are for open borders or not.
I say closed borders. It's game theoretically stupid to have open borders in one direction.
Plus libertarians also accept property rights. You can just think of the nation as a piece of property a country of people have a stake in. And they can use violence to defend it.
At the end of the day borders come from war treaties, deplomacy, etc. but they are ultimately based on who is powerful enough to defend them
Ron Paul actually clarified this years ago in that when they talk about open borders they mean between states only. He specifically said open borders between countries is suicide
It's really assymetric with countries. Some countries have way more opportunity than others so obviously you get third world people trying to move to the third world.
They know they were born in shit holes and want out.
We know they come from shit holes and we don't wanna go there
Simple.
Maybe it could work between a group of partnering countries. EU is one example I suppose, but IIUC it's a lot of people moving from East to West Europe, not the other way.
It would work better if the countries were more similar in terms of opportunities
100 IQ geniuses who think they're "politically homeless" are the most irritating, worst people to deal with. At least a leftist will just openly admit they want to kill you and why, a "BOTH sides are bad" libertarian can't even be that honest.
I've said it enough times, the right wing libertarians need to rebrand and separate from the centrists(i.e. weakly principled) and leftists. Hans-Hermann Hoppe, Heinlein, Ron Paul and some others were less retarded and came to libertarianism as a practical solution to the dangers of rabid authoritarianism.
Hoppe in particular stated the principle of estoppel, in which someone who does not respect and threatens freedom of X shall not reap the benefits of X. There's that Frank Herbert quote about subversive, destructive elements conveniently exploiting the other group's principled nature against them.
That and whether minarchist or anarcho-capitalist, only those that believe in many borders are resonant with private property. Maybe an interstate within a nation so people can reach their community without being extorted by a feudal lord along the way.
I’d say I’m still a big fan of Ron Paul and have read all of his books but I don’t see libertarians making any impact
Not quite right. They wouldn't dare say something like "violence is wrong" when faced with someone chanting "I hate you and I hate America!". They only say "violence is wrong" when someone defends themselves against that chanter inevitably attacking an innocent.
The only thing I really side with the libertarians on is the gun issue, and the drug issue.
I should be able to manufacture unregistered fully automatic weapons, homemade explosives, and methamphetamine in my garage, unironically.
Like an actual libertarian somewhere or just the strawman you've created?
A bunch on Twitter are sperging about it. I say this as someone who considers himself libertarian and spends time in those circles. Same thing happened with the Kimmel firing. A lot of these guys need to learn the friend/enemy distinction.
Was always suspicious of Libertarians.
They are small c conservatives with no morals.