The other day I was driving home and listening to sports radio and I guess they had been talking about a trade a team didn't make and the fans were angry. One of the hosts said that the angry fans reminded him of nerds who get angry and become toxic because their fan theories didn't come true. I couldn't have rolled my eyes any harder.
Just brought back memories of all the moronic critics when The Last Jedi came out. It wasn't enough to simply say they enjoyed the movie, they had to crap on everyone who didn't and Disney being Disney went along with it. I remember hearing the "you're just mad because your fan theories did come true" or "You just wanted to see a heroic Luke" I remember asking someone who said those exact things why it was a bad thing to want to see a heroic Luke. They didn't respond.
This also popped up in Game of Thrones with Arya killing the Night King and people getting called sexist for saying that it should've been Jon.
I guess in hindsight this exposed all the media shills for what they were. Anyone who was actually interested in the IP would know that fan theories have been around in nerdom since the beginning. Anyone who actually cared about the IPs would know this, but this is what happens when a site/channel that was made to cater to fans is bought out by a corporation and gets re-staffed with a bunch of hacks. Sci-Fi Channel and the Star Wars websites I would frequent in the 90s and early 00s come to mind.
This is just a form of gaslighting they use to try and make it out that the problem is you and not them ruining the industries we all care about. It's very much the same meta with games where they try and gaslight people and try to make it out they're just 'growing out of video games' when any one of us who actually likes video games knows you can still pick up a lot of the older games out there and enjoy them like you were five again because that's how good they were. Or given how bad things are now, you could pick up an average game you weren't that keen on back in the day and it's still better than the absolute shite being churned out now.
There was a great video I watched by a guy who did a really detailed break down of shooters and why he thinks they're bad and he brought up this issue of gaslighting fucks as well. The same people doing this are the ones wrecking the industry, alternatively they're normies who don't even have hobbies worth talking about anyway so them passing judgement on nerds is hilarious when you think about it.
Fantheories unfortunately are a real problem, though never from the people they accuse of it.
Tumblr headcanon girls and gays will absolutely use their beliefs, and the show not pandering to them, to harass and attack everyone possible to straight up evil extents. Not making Watson gay for Sherlock during that show's heyday was a big one. As is basically any time two males who once looked at each other don't end up butt pounding, really.
And yet, the fantheories they usually attack are one's that are either adaptation based, and thereby on good authority to expect, or simply logical followthroughs that are usually shit on by introducing elements that didn't exist prior.
I don’t disagree. I guess my beef is like you said. They don’t attack the people who want everyone gay but theorizing that Luke will do great things in TLJ makes you a Nazi
Well, he's not entirely wrong. Shippers go absolutely ballistic when the ships they theorized and argued about online for years and wrote endless fanfics for don't pan out. One only needs to look at the abuse Adam Driver got to see what I mean, not only for his character not hooking up with Rey, but for him not hooking up with Daisy Ridley in real life, despite the fact that he was married and had a child underway at the time. But since they're always a combination of autistic, female, lefty, alphabet, and self-proclaimed alphabet ally, they're just conveniently ignored.
Let's also ignore the fact that there were no "fan theories" concerning the Star Wars heroes' fates; there was an entire expanded universe that said all there was to say about them that people generally really liked. Then Disney omitted all that and replaced it with a shoddy film trilogy that turned Luke, Leia, Han, and everyone else into losers whose accomplishments amounted to jack-all. Of course people are going to get mad when you take away something good and substitute it with something godawful.
One point of fairness I'll give to this is that it's the only important thing Arya actually does in the entirety of the series. Her story is otherwise completely isolated from everyone else's and never has an effect on the larger world until that point. However, that doesn't justify her killing the Night King; it just goes to show how the showrunners never had a clue what the point behind her character was, and possibly by extension, neither does Martin.
I liked Arya. I think it would’ve been cool to have Jon and Ayra fight the Night King together. I do believe that part of the downfall of Game of Thrones was the girl power push at the end. You don’t have a collision course between Jon and the Night King only to subvert expectations. Also I give Martin most of the blame.
I never understood why those shippers never received the same hatred that we did for not liking Last Jedi. I got downvoted on Star Wars Reddit (haven’t been there in years now) for saying the EU did much better job with Han/Luke/Leia.
To be honest when I saw your title my mind went somewhere else. I thought of the old "the Rugrats don't exist and are a figment of Angelica's imagination" theory that's been floating around the internet. Evil isn't a descriptor that would have come to mind for me but it was close enough I guess.
Those are fun as well. Have you heard the one with Batman? That he is really an inmate in Arkham and his delusions make him think he is a crime fighter? Or the one that says the events of Breaking Bad started the zombie infection in Walking Dead
My favorite fan theory is that The Flintstones and The Jetsons take place at the same time and years after an apocalypse.
As far as Star Wars the lefties who loved The Last Jedi dismissed the majority of criticism aganist it, but when The Rise of Skywalker they used almost the same criticism used against TLJ for TROS.
I noticed that when episode 9 came out. Although as an EU fan I loved seeing all the Disney Star Wars people who bashed Dark Empire trying to justify the emperor clone. I never heard that about Jetsons and Flintstones. You ever hear that Elder Scrolls takes place in the far future from Fallout?
I never heard the Skyrim, Fallout theory. I know Easter eggs exist in the two games since Bethesda made them
Darth Jar Jar is my favorite theory, although that's more of a behind-the-scenes speculation instead of fanfiction
I have heard that Lucas had bigger plans for Jar Jar. Him being a Sith Lord does seem kinda cool
I still get blowback for not liking The Last Jedi from a friend, and you can tell he does not think the movie was good but he wants to show how he is "progressive superior". Last time it was about superhero movies :) and I get the same thing, he knows that the new movies and series are bad but he can't get himself to say it because he feels superior for liking them.
I’ve seen people like that. I remember critics talking about the last Jedi examine themes of failure as if that hasn’t been examined in thousands of movies before. In Empire Luke ignored Yoda and failed.
There are so many things wrong with that movie, and the so-called “theme of failure” is a great example. People only grab onto it because one of the characters comes about as close to turning and saying it directly to the camera as he can. If you look at what happens, it doesn’t make any sense to call that the “theme.”
Poe makes nothing but correct choices and gets shit all over for it. Where’s the failure and the lesson for him?
Finn… fails to find the master coder and ends up learning that… there are evil people on both sides… and this lesson causes him to recommit himself to one side in particular? Except at the end where his very rational, necessary act of self-sacrifice is randomly (impossibly) sabotaged, resulting in what should be the death of the entire resistance except that the cave with no back door has a secret back door? Utterly incoherent and has nothing to do with failure.
Rey does not fail at anything she attempts, ever. She is given multiple unearned victories, in fact.
How does this “great theme” apply to any of our three primary characters? It doesn’t. The movie says it does, but the movie says a lot of things that make no sense upon examination, and this is just one more. Even if you say “actually, it’s not a theme, it ONLY applies to Luke,” then that isn’t something you can apply to the defense of other parts of the movie. Not to mention that the failure and the lesson only work if you have a character that isn’t Luke Skywalker in anything but name.
But rewriting ripely will call you a Nazi despite the fact that you dismantled that movie using facts. How that movie became a darling for critics I’ll never know
It had a “diverse” cast of main characters, and shat all over beloved white characters and the world those characters lived in.
Well I guess I understand now why it is but at the time I was confused about it. Also remember it had much more capable women
Well… Rey aside, the women are another case where what the movie tells us about them being right and competent is at odds with what actually happens.
Holdo’s lack of communication nearly gets everyone killed, and her plan hinges on the First Order forgetting that they can just push a button to reveal cloaked ships. The fact that they do is just dumb, not her genius.
Leia and Holdo both unfairly castigate Poe for destroying the dreadnought, despite the fact that the bombers could not have been recalled safely, the dreadnought would have destroyed the whole fleet, and the very scene prior, Leia was talking about how they needed a galvanizing victory like the one over the first Death Star. The destruction of the first Death Star saw a massively powerful weapon defeated by a group of underdogs at the cost of nearly every ship sent against it being destroyed. The destruction of the dreadnought should fulfill this criteria, but the movie ignores that. (This line is actually doubly retarded, since they destroyed Starkiller Base about 12 hours ago in-universe, but unfortunately, the line is in the movie).
Rose effectively dooms the resistance when she stops Finn from destroying the cannon. It’s dumb luck that this doesn’t result in everyone’s death, and physically confusing, given where she strands them, that she and Finn aren’t immediately killed by the First Order. Everything else she does is net neutral. (Except for her complete lack of comms discipline leading to DJ exposing the escape plan to the First Order, but in fairness, Finn is equally to blame here).
Arguably, even Rey gets handed a massive failure in the form of an idiot moment when the movie confirms that she woke up before Kylo after the explosion in the throne room and left in Snoke’s shuttle, but apparently didn’t do anything like attempt to capture, kill, or even inconvenience Kylo while she was standing over his unconscious body.
There was also the suicide hyperspace jump tactic totally invalidating everything we'd ever seen about space battles in the setting. If that works, why wouldn't you just use droid piloted fighter-sized kamikazes to destroy all of an enemy's capital ships, or put a hyperdrive on an asteroid and smash it into a planet instead of building a gigantic spaceship?
I remember watching the movie and being so confused about the point of Holdo’s character or the point of the casino. Well now I realize the point was to lecture
He wasn't even the right fucking person, either. Just a rando criminal. Yes, let's trust a damn random criminal in jail and tell him our plan instead of trying to find the right person again. Surely, this criminal won't lie just to get out of jail.
I'm not normally a fan of belittling people, but people like that need to get made fun of more. They need to constantly be reminded that their opinions are shit and unacceptable. They are mental slaves and need strong thought influencers to push them in the right direction.
No fucking shit?
Why dont you want to see a heroic Luke?
The people who say stuff like this are probably the types who say that you can never have heroes and that everything must be anti-heroes and grey morality, because its more "realistic" and "true to life" since "heroes dont exist". Also usually stuff about how wanting heroes is "childish" and that you just need to grow up.
Personally, while I used to like anti-heroes (and still do for ones like Punisher and Judge Dredd), I have been getting burned out on this whole "edgy anti-hero" shit and just want heroes and villains again. Because, to quote an old song I like, "The genre's called 'Fantasy'! Its meant to be unrealistic you myopic manatee!"
Yea, my brother was shocked because I’m not watching The Boys and he knows I’m into comic books. I said I’m so sick of the deconstruction of superheros. I liked the Watchmen comic book but that’s good for a nice twist every now and then. I’m currently reading a comic book of Captain America from 93 and have been reading some Superman issues from the 70s.
There is a part of me that wonders if part of the reason that the Puss In Boots did so well is because it did have an actual villain, who openly admits he is a villain, and famously has a scene where when someone finally admits "You're evil!" He just says "Oh, you are only just now figuring that out?!" Which is so unheard of for a lot of movies, and now it gets done in a kids movie of all things.
Probably. With everything grey that’s great to hear. I’ve heard good things about that one
Yea I remember scratching my head at the defenses for this movie. Rey lecturing Luke and the woman being much better than the guy is pretty standard now. I also remember the critics praising the fact that Rey was a nobody because it showed “greatness can come from anywhere”. Certainly no story has ever shown that or let’s ignore that Anakin was a slave. Also, in the EU it never said Jedi have to come from an elite family or in the prequels Jedi are all over. Just an example of pretentious fake fans
Honestly, the thing that made me the maddest about the Sequels was how they treated Kylo and Poe.
Yes, in the first movie, Kylo was an emotional brat who got beat by Rey the first time they fought. But because I was naïve still at the time and thought they knew what they were doing, I thought it was being set up that that was the point. And come Episode 8 they would have him getting dressed down by Snoke for his failure, have him bring up how he claims to be the heir of Vader and yet lost to a novice, and then have him start undergoing Dark Side training to be made into a threat the next time he faced Rey. Not only did that not happen, they kept nerfing him to appeal to the Shippers.
And Poe made what was objectively the correct call as a military commander, was abused by his commanding officer, and the movie treats it like he is the bad guy here. I spent the entire god damn movie utterly convinced "Hyperspace Tracking" was a myth and that Holdo was a traitor because she was doing everything you would expect a traitor to do. And I was gobsmacked when it turn out she was wrong and the movie was making it out like Poe was a brainlet for thinking what any reasonable human and soldier would think with an officer liker her.
Have I mentioned that Ep. 8 holds the unique "honor" of being the only movie that has ever retroactively ruined my enjoyment of another movie? Because at the time I actually really liked Ep. 7 and wrote off all of its issues as "They are just getting back in the game. Ep. 8 will fix some of this funk." Meanwhile....
Yea episode 8 and how Disney has treated the fans is a huge part of the reason I’m purely pre Disney Star Wars. Currently reading some legends books. I get they wanted to do their own thing but they couldn’t just have legends in a separate continuity or continue stories in that universe? And with the sequels if you weren’t going to use what Lucas had then why not do a loose adaption of Thrawn trilogy or NJO? Another dumb move was not having Luke’s Jedi Academy. Rey beating Kylo after just learning about the force seems like major girl power in hindsight. One of the opening scenes in episode 7 should’ve been Luke instructing a group of young Jedi. Also having Han/Luke/Leia and maybe Lando in a scene towards the beginning seems like a layup
Ironically the head cannon types get really angry that Harry and Ron aren't gay. The treatment of only one side as unhinged as the others gets whatever they want is why forums like this exist.
Aren’t there people that want characters in Frozen to be gay? But these “make them gay” people never get called toxic
We just call them Tumblrites.
Never look into Supernatural fan stuff too far.
I can only imagine but I’ll ask…. there are those that want the two brothers romantically involved?
It's called, Wincest
With Castiel, yes.
Which is when you know it's officially over and you can't do anything about it except cut it out of your life. I tried to keep star trek alive, but JJ Abrams put it out of its misery after Enterprise and Voyager made it sick. There's nothing left, just memories.
We have to make our own culture now.
Agreed but I can still enjoy Star Trek up to the Enterprise finale. I did like the first JJ movie at the time because it was cool to see Nimoy but not so much anymore and I still like pre Disney Star Wars
God damn did that movie hurt. I loved Nimoy. He made the world a better place, even when he was pushing bunk science for tv ratings.
the fans are not the problem.
Arya killing the Night King was stupid because she'd had absolutely no interaction with him or any White Walkers before it happened. You can't just have a good guy kill a bad guy when they've never met and have it be satisfying when you have Jon Snow right there.
Well since they were close I figured if they were intent on having Ayra involved then they could’ve fought together but their excuse for not letting Jon kill or even fight the Night king was idiotic. They actually said that’s what everyone expects. Well yes because Jon has been dealing with the white walkers since the beginning. It’s hard to come up with any reason other than girl power for it.
In the first seasons Renly was killed by a shadow assassin birthed by Melisandre. His army collapsed and the remnants were subsequently absorbed by his brother. There are other examples of this in GOT lore.
The theory was sound: kill the leader, and the army dissolves.This was especially true in the case of the Night King. But in this case it came across as weak and pathetic, because they sullied the show with feminism-on-stilts prior to her arrival at Winterfell. Also, her skills were no match for an army of undead. They were setting her up as the killer-to-be as a supernatural assassin, but her powers didn't allow for her to infiltrate the Night King's army.
it's a sign of bad storytelling when you try to subvert expectations just for the sake of doing it, you have to be a much better writer than the guys behind the Game of Thrones show to pull it off.