I was reading "Discours de la Servitude Volontaire" (Discourse on voluntary servitude), a very old book written by a 18-19 year old "Étienne de la Boétie" who discusses basically why people obey and serve.
My interrogations began when I went for a dental cleaning. The hygienist spent a whole hour with me. The dentist saw me at most I'd say a minute.
The hygienist makes 60,000$ per year, of which the government will rob $20,000 "at source." This leaves her with $40,000 per year, or a bit over $3,300 net per month.
The dentists makes well over $500,000. Of course, it's considered business income, so it is taxed at 8% maximum (if it is taxed at all). He can of course pay himself a dividend, which is not-taxed for the first $60,000 (our lady's whole salary), and then at half the rate that lady's income. With a huge tax credit and really no deduction.
Still too high? Go for capital gains, deduce everything, and you will pay 10-15% taxes.
And I got to think: how exactly is that fair? First, how is it fair that the dentist makes so much more than her? Who would accept to work for 10% of the salary of their coworkers? Yes, dentist requires more skill, more studies, more education, and comes with risk. Yes you have to diagnose horrible stuff from time to time and if you mess up, consequences are bad. But is it really worth 10 times the salary of that hygienist?
With huge tax benefits? I'm a teacher and I net around the same amount as that hygienist. I also have university education, and I teach kids, which should be important (it's not but whatever).
Is what this dentist doing worth really that much more than me?
I don't understand. It must be pretty humiliating to look in a mirror and think "I am worth 10% of that person." And I'm not talking about a top-tier, elite programmer or engineer. And to make it worse - you have to give half your income as taxes anyway!
Why, why do people accept that? What's the point? You live like shit while the rich (and dentist is chump change in terms of rich people) enjoy life and laugh at you.
Is this really what life is about?
And by the way, it would be one thing if life was at least pleasant and government offered good services. Every single governmental service is junk. I work at a private school, and you can bet all rich people send their kids there. Why, if public school is so good, do they do that? Same for medicine, supposedly free - all rich people go to private clinic.
I tried to go the ER once. 18 hours of waiting, to get prescribed a tylenol. Gas is a real fortune, public transport shows up 50% of the time on a good day, roads are garbage, homeless are everywhere (masturbate in metro), food is so expensive a steak is a pipe dream for me, they took our guns away for no reason, now they ask for ID to go online the UK, they are about to censor the whole internet...
... and people just, like, passively accept that? "No problem sir, here's half my income so you guys can get another 30% raise (true story!). Do you need more?"
Why?
Like our hygienist - doesn't she feel humiliated doing 90% of the job and earning 10% of the salary - and then having a third (at best) stolen? Doesn't she feel like she's wasting her life, a subhuman, inferior, useless? At least as a teacher, I can pretend I do something that matters. It's a lie of course, but I can say "i help children grow up, I make a difference." And even there, no one at that school makes 10 times my salary, only the CEO earns 3-4 times at most (private school).
I don't get it. In "Discourse of voluntary servitude", La Boétie says it'S basically a) habit b) pleasure. That people get accustomed to be water carriers and slave from a young age. And that governments use pleasure to control people. But ultimately, he claims people are the most responsible for their situations. Like Orwell in 1984, when he says the pleb could always rebel and overthrow the regime, but never does.
I hate this world. Sigh.
If the dentist is not there, the hygienist has no job. A lot of offices will have several hygienists to one dentist. Is the dentist 10x more valuable to the continued operation of the establishment? Yes.
This is "the secretary is just important as the boss" thinking. They're not. If the clerical work was as important as the main job, the boss would be doing it themselves or split with an equal partner. The whole reason those specific tasks are offloaded is because they're doable by someone with less specialized skills, less training, and less experience.
Your post gets way to caught up in how it "feels" and misses reality completely. If every hygienist became a dentist, you'd have a bunch of dentists spending most of their time doing hygienist tasks, while being in competition with one another and under pressure to cut costs to compete (because the cost of dental care just skyrocketed). It would logically give rise to a specialized position to do the repetitive bulk tasks for less pay but also less investment. Which people would only accept if the effort/value proposition was amenable to them. It's not "slavery" or "humiliation," is basic-ass division of labor and a market working properly.
You're right about income taxes being bullshit though.
But back to your original question, why do you do what you do instead of having reached whatever the peak of power, money, and influence is? Are you happy being a slave? You're positing that it can only be habit or pleasure. You're also positing that you hate that. So you must incredibly successful, right? Because it'd be neither habit nor pleasure for you.
Eh sort of. Its mostly just credentialism and cronyism that provides rich people with jobs/roles. Although certain businessmen have actually created some products, most everyone wealthy is simply in a protected status. Ie they can sue or use licensing to prevent competition.
The "effort value proposition" for work is "you slave your entire life away risking injury and death just to survive, or you die here and now" Most people choose survival over suicide.
You say you are college educated, but clearly you never went anywhere near an accounting class.
I guarantee that dentist is paying far more in taxes than you say. Yes, he takes home more, but he is the one taking the risk by running his own business, so he should take home more. If that business fails, all losses and debt accrued are on him, not his hygienist.
This is the way entrepreneurship works, someone(s) take on the risk of opening a new business, and they reap the most rewards (or consequences if the business fails) accordingly.
You're talking to someone who studied at college than immediately went to work for the gay race communism public school system with indexed pensions, salary grids and commie unions.
Like I had a choice....................
You could have majored in something else?
MY! Why didn't I think of that? What an absolutely brilliant idea! I'll make sure to invent a time machine to go back in time and warn me my job is going to suck later!!!
Your guarantee is wrong. Risk is negligible because dentists are a fixed supply vs more and more demandd. I will admit some of them do free treatment and all that. But most are cooks.
Taxes in Canada are very different. In Québec, you pay 8% in taxes on your first 500k of profit as a business AND you also get massive tax credits.
Dentist pay very little, if any taxes.
And success is determined entirely by your starting wealth and who you know. If someone like me with no money and connections tried to start a business it would be all expense with no revenue.
"My income is a measurement of my worth."
Listen to yourself.
it is though.
No, it isn't.
I have enough money to live, why do I need more? If I was a Jew, I could buy politicians but I'm not, so I can't.
What I do have is two amazing kids, good friends, respect of my neighbours etc.
I'd rather spend my time clearing snow for the oldies in my building than worry about how much my dentist makes.
I can't get a woman to start a family with because they have no reason to settle for me. If I had money to throw around and waste I'd be able to get a woman that way.
Nah. She'd get you and half of what you have after the divorce.
I'd kill the bitch for trying to leave me. All I care about is reproduction and I'd be willing to die in prison if it means achieving that goal and getting revenge of the evil whore who ruined my life. Divorce is evil and sadistic, it's akin to murder.
Do some soul searching and find God.
Be a man worthy of Christ, and then you'll be a man worthy of Christ's goal for you. If that vocation is marriage, God will provide a spouse. By living a life of Christ seeking a spouse, you might just find one.
No woman worth having will only seek your money. Be a good man, and be a good provider, and you'll become attractive to the right women.
Divorce is evil, but evil upon evil or to stop evil isn't good or holy. Revenge is anti-Christ.
Material wealth is fleeting. Happy are those who are poor in spirit, for theirs is the Kingdom of God. Don't seek or envy materials - do not place them above the Lord God, for that is just having an idol.
Just the same worthless shit I've heard my whole fucking life. Absolutely useless an unactionable.
I've spent half my life trying to get a woman and I still haven't had so much as a first date or a first kiss, let alone sex. The average preteen has more experience in life than I do.
Is there anything that prevents a trained Dental Hygenist from opening a dental clinic and hiring a trained dentist who they pay a salary while they run everything on the business side? I don’t think so.
I think most dental hygienists are women who enjoy having a job where you spend hours upon hours chatting with clients and coworkers while performing menial tasks like polishing teeth and picking out plaque
And most trained dentists aren’t retards (they have a kind of medical degree) so they’ll enjoy taking on more responsibility (owning and administering a business, feeding a horde of women with 1 year college diplomas, multiple children and probably far fewer fathers) while reaping the benefits of that extra responsibility
Just my uninformed take on the scenario presented
Dentistry is a lot more about dexterity than intelligence or problem-solving.
One note is that there's a dexterity aptitude component that must be passed to gain admission to dental school.
While there's no dexterity component whatsoever to apply to medical school or to be accepted to a surgical residency program.
I've worked with general surgeons who've had the craziest spastic essential tremors in the OR that you've ever seen.
Need a loan to open a clinic, no bank will loan to a dental hygienist.
They will lend to a dentist though.
shakes fist at bankers
Yes there are a ton of barriers to opening a business or clinic within healthcare.
Ones which only apply to dental hygienists who want to open a clinic and not to dentists? That was the topic. Obviously oral surgery is a highly regulated profession.
Yes dental hygienists must work under a dentist, they cannot work independently.
There’s no regulations, afaik, against a trained dental hygienist operating a dental clinic where they pay a trained dentist a salary to work for them and perform the dentist-specific work. Many, many dental clinics are owned by someone other than the dentist(s) working there. Often a corporation or non-profit, neither of which require a trained dentist to operate.
Will a bank be more likely to give a trained dentist a loan to open a dental clinic than a trained dental hygienist? Uhh… yeah, probably… if you had $100,000 to invest and one of your friends spent a year in college and your other friend spent 8+ years getting a dentistry degree and has already spent 2 years working clinically to get their license, who are you going to pick 9 times out of 10? I know you weren't making that argument im kind of replying to a couple comments with this, hope you don’t mind lol
I assume you’re in the US so for tax purposes I have to consider it as such, but I can’t think unless you’re in a tax haven somewhere that anywhere else would be better. Whatever you’re describing that the dentists does there in taxes is either misinformed or tax fraud. I think you’d find a dentist who owns their own practice and makes a profit of $500k a year is probably getting absolutely screwed over by taxes more so than about any group in a tax bracket. The ones that benefit from the tax system the most is the bottom group who gets the gibs and the top group who only has capital gains.
As for a hygienist. I suspect they enjoy a stable field that’s low stress and very consistent and not demanding as such that they can’t still tend to their family. It’s an ideal career for a woman who wants to work but still has correct priorities.
I tend to agree with you on the rest, but it can be difficult to break out of being a wage slave. It requires either luck or extreme discipline, and even then won’t work for everyone. Like the other post says, there’s zero reason a hygienist couldn’t own the business and hire a dentist. There are plenty of dentists who work for salary and while they are very well paid it’s not $500k
OP is a leaf.
I would assume their taxes are a lot worse, but if that's the case and businesses are taxed so significantly less, then everyone should run a business that can.
Only a tiny tiny portion of men could ever own a successful business. it requires lots of money and lots of connections.
Effective taxation for businesses is often 3-8%. That is, unless you make millions in profits.
Effective taxations for all workers is 33%-60%.
If true then the Canadian tax system is very broken and also very, very friendly to entrepreneurs and I’d be totally shocked.
Under US tax code, some of what you describe in other posts like car, vacations, part of home being deducted would be somewhere in the range of abuse of a gray area and tax fraud. For a typical average dentist with a clinic it would very much be closer to fraud as travel to your main place of work (your clinic) isn’t business travel, there’s not much case for business use of your home, and at best you could write off something like traveling to a dental conference that also worked as a vacation.
Even more key, in most scenarios you’d be required to pay yourself a reasonable salary, and that would be fully taxed just as if it were anyone else’s wages. So yeah, you might get away with some of the gray areas in the previous paragraph but having no reasonable salary or making no money year after year as a dentist would flag you for review so quickly.
For business, taxes are WAY lower here than in the US.
I use to have a business to do basic yard maintenance... at its top, it pulled $80,000 a year (a huge amount back then) and I paid less than $1,500 in taxes.
In canada, you can just pay yourself a $1 salary, and then a $80,000 dividend, almost tax free
Then when you sell the business only half is taxed, and at your capital gains. You can also spread the "sale" on a longer period, so your $1M "profit" becomes a $50,000 annual income for 10 years. So almost no taxes.
Unfortunately.
Independent contractor professionals like dentists tend to grow their wealth by keeping money in their shell, one-man "professional corporation" and letting it sit unused for years.
The problem these professionals have is that they can absolutely raped by the tax man any time they try to extract any monies out of the corporate holders to pay themselves a salary or a dividend to live in. OP is mistaken about paying themselves dividends. These tend to get tax raped just like any salary they pay themselves. They are treated differently than stock dividends, etc.
One of the few ways to extract money from the shell corporation is to bring their own family members on board to pay out salaries to them at lower tax rates. But the family members actually have to have proof of employment at your practice. You can't just start writing cheques in your middle school daughters name. The tax man will very soon start poking around looking for receipts that they are actually working at your office 40 hours a week.
The professional doctor/lawyer/accountant professional corp bubble also was burst last decade. Trudeau specifically targeted these upper middle class small business structures and publicly waged a war against them "not paying their fair share" when his government's banana republic piggybank started bouncing cheques. And of course it worked, because the commies and all the poor on the gibs love to work up all the hate over envy for those just a few rungs ahead of them.
I dunno if the taxes break down that way, but there are a couple of contextual factors:
the dental industry is kind of a cartel and dentists control the supply so their wages are raised overall. This is a problem with medical doctors as well. Because of the extensive professional training required, it's possible to exert more anticompetitive pressure through training pipelines, professional associations, politics, etc. See the existence of guilds.
dentistry has more inherent liability than other professions, so it's going to be valued higher by some amount no matter what. If a dentist screws up somebody's teeth then he's headed for a malpractice suit. If a teacher screws up a kid's education of algebra or something, there are very little consequences. I don't necessarily think that teaching should be that way, but it remains the truth that you can muddle through teaching on your own personal predilections (whatever those are) and you'll rack up seniority and pay no matter what. Most people have seen plenty of examples.
If a student seduces you so she can entrap and extort you or even just CLAIMS that you fucked her your life is over. Don't give me that bullshit about teaching being a low liability job. You have to fuck up BAD as a dentist to get a prison sentence, but all it takes as a teacher is an opportunity and a moment of weakness from a life that has abused you and denied you female companionship your entire life.
Even if that were true, personal risk is not the definition of a high liability job. Infantrymen have a real chance of getting killed even in peacetime, but they're paid about as much as teachers because the supply is high due to the barrier of entry being low.
I disagree lol
You mean parents harassing you?
No I meant for the kid. Gonna be bagging groceries all his life
Probably not, but bad teachers do have significant negative impact
Grades don't matter. Schooling doesn't matter. You learn zero relevant or practical knowledge in school from age 5 to 18.
Money, connections, and people skills (real or euphemistically speaking) matter.
Tbf youre not completely wrong unfortunately.......................
Someone said OP is a leaf, so we'll go with that. OP also said "dividend," so we'll assume the practice is incorporated as a professional cooptation. OP's claims don't seem correct.
Basically, the reason the dividends are taxed at a lower rate is because they were already subject to corporate tax. Salary is taxed harder on the individual but deductible from the corporates tax as a business expense. Sounds like it's roughly a balance in total tax contributions. Another possible benefit to the dividend is maybe no forced contribution to the mandatory retirement program (because the shareholder/employee distinction? I'm not going to go that deep down the rabbit hole.
True, but slightly misleading. In some provinces, with NO other income, with the right type of dividend, within specific value limits, then yes. Also, that's after corporate taxes, so even in the "not-taxed" case it's been taxed by the feds and the province once already.
This is based on very brief reading, so I'm not 100%.
https://www.canada.ca/en/revenue-agency/services/tax/businesses/topics/corporations/corporation-tax-rates.html
The normal cooperate tax rate is 38% + whatever the province sticks on top of that. Canadians are being raped in taxes. But for a Canadian-controlled private business, qualifying for a small business deduction, then it drops to of 9%-12.2% up to the $500k OP precisely chose as an example. After that it jumps substantially. Same with the number they picked for the $60k dividend.
I have two dentist friends and they each net 30,000-40,000$ a month. They don't even do advanced surgeries...
Car is paid by business, vacations paid by business, they even deduce part of their home insurance/electricity/insurance. With all due respect - your knowledge of canadian tax law is very, very limited.
Per dentist.
Not sure about the rest you posted. No businesses in Canada pays anything close to 38%. And fyi, a business is either incorporated in a province OR federally, not both.
If the business is making more than $500k, a substantially higher rates kick in, according to that link from the Canadian Government at least.
I don't know much about the subject, but basic research indicates you know less. Look up any business tax guide for Canada. Have one from a Canadian accounting firm. https://accountor.ca/blog/taxation/corporate-tax-rate.html
"But I only said they weren't incorporated in both. I didn't say they weren't taxed by both." Then that comment is a non-sequitur because you were implying it.
But you're right. 38% is the basic rate on paper. Then they modify the hell out of it with various special treatments. Normal small business federal rate seems to be 9% up to 500k.
In all due respect, you don't know what youre talking about.
You are being taxed on PROFITS, NOT income. And you can deduce a TON of epenses as a business.
Stop doing a chatgpt3.0 and linking very basic (and useless) general websites, stfu, and just admit you lost.
For instance, salaries are DEDUCTIBLE from a business income (like most expenses)
Wow! Who knew. Let me check my original post:
Oh, you got me!
Edit: Wait just a second. I didn't see it sooner. "Canadian," illiterate, unjustified self-confidence... saar, why are you posting here saar! Right now you must be do the needful!
Alright shut up jogger.
"I never lived in Canada, I have no idea how Canadian taxation works (I bet you dont even know québec has a different legal systems from everywhere else in north america neither) but I'm still going to highly specific, highly detailled accounting and financial advice.
OK bro, go back to school.
Ugh, right through the heart. You got me. Take your izzat and go :(
Lol. But seriously, I never gave a single word of advice.
Dontt worry one day you will graduate high school
Dependence. Talk to any dental hygienist if they want to reduce their taxes and most will say no. They vote for higher taxes so they can get more "free" stuff from the government.
Also, most slaves are low quality people and there's more low quality people (slaves) then higher quality. A lot of these people might not be able to survive in a world without being a slave (think how people say cows would go instinct if humans didn't domesticate them). A lot of humans who are spiritual slaves wouldn't survive if they were given freedom (and perhaps they understand this) so they vote to continue their servitude so they can survive.
This is some boomer bootstraps shit. EMTs and paramedics often qualify for foodstamps while roastie HR managers and "diversity consultants" pull in a half mil or more a year sitting in a chair doing Zoom meetings and making TikToks about how little actual work they do. And (((40% of the 1%))) make more money than we'll see in a lifetime actively destroying society. Why should Blackrock be worth trillions for pushing nigger worship and faggotry into everything?
EMTs and Paramedics don't contribute much to society. I agree that HR is a waste. You can thank government regulations for that. Abolishing the Civil Rights Act would help. Blackrock shouldn't be worth that but they are because of a lack of nationalistic regulations. Still, between a dentist and a dental hygienist, most hygienists are not competent enough to be a dentist even if they tried.
Nigga what
They don't. Aside from a small minority of accidents, they mostly serve druggies, people with health issues and old people all of whom don't contribute much to society so by extension, the EMTs don't either. For the vast majority of people, they don't really do much. Also, a lot of paramedics/EMTs do take a pay cut because they like helping people so their pay is lower since they derive personal benefit helping others (which is like pay to them from a QoL perspective).
Taxes aren't what's causing them to be paid a tenth as much as the boss.
The government is though. Our government sets requirements on becoming a dentist which causes artificial reductions in supply of dentists. Also if she was competent enough she could become a dentist herself but she isn't.
Competence doesn't matter, only connections and qualifications.
This is not true at all for a dentist and for many jobs.
Nope, it's true for all jobs. It's a struggle to even get even the most undesirable of jobs if you don't have connections.
I got my job without any connections. You're just so blackpilled you've decided to make excuses for everything. Competency does matter to an extent. If you told me you were a White male and that makes it harder to get a job despite competence, you'd be correct. Most dental hygienists are not people you want to be your dentist.
I've tried getting a job without connections and I got nowhere with my applications.
Something, something inner monologue. Something else about visualizing apples. This applies in general, it's not restricted to your dentist example.
nope, just lack of opportunity. normal men have no power over our lives and are just forced into whatever we can get.
Dentist are the most sadistic people ever. People accept everything because everyone is full of sh3t and cant react anymore.
It is all they know.
Because the alternative is death. We have no options beside take what we're given or die.
It isn't voluntary, it's hardly different from being forced to labor at gun point.
Ok OP, now disclose which country/state your posting this from because right now your thread is just another dime a dozen doomer miasma meant to demoralize.
Québec
Path of Least Resistance
athe larger a population, the more they will trend towards what is familiar and easy.
I dunno what this is all about but I like my hygienist more then my dentist who wasn't even there last time I went for a cleaning the bastard