Cameron clearly doesn't know what he's talking about if he's saying this. The whole reason people cared about the MCU was because it had interesting heroes with compelling journeys (before it went woke, anyway). You can't just feed people slop and expect your movies to succeed, they need more than that.
Then again, Cameron lost his credibility a long time ago. He called Terminator: Dark Fate the true sequel to Terminator 2 even though that movie gave John Connor the Luke Skywalker treatment.
I think there's little doubt that Avatar 2 (and the other sequels that for some godforsaken reason he's making) will not only be worse than the first movie, but they'll also be massive financial failures.
They could be just as big as the first movie and still be financial failures. Cameron has already admitted that this movie needs to make almost $2 BILLION...JUST TO BREAK EVEN!! And considering the metrics coming in are that it had a strong opening but is starting to fall off, just like every other movie with bad word of mouth...
Top Gun: Maverick already showed Hollywood that you can make billions of dollars, with almost nothing but the American box office (so you dont have to worry about China banning your movie), and have positive word of mouth, and all you have to do is give the people what they want in a movie and make something fun. It doesnt even need to break new ground, just not suck compared to the last.
That Hollywood continues to treat Top Gun like a pariah and hiss at its presence shows that their hatred is deliberate, and they would rather go bankrupt making movies that appeal to their personal bubble and let them sniff their own farts long before they make a movie that appeals to...ewwww "Normal people."
Kevin Feige pulled from the best story beats of 50+ years to make a modern retelling of classic comics. There, that's it. That's what he did.
People keep saying the MCU is just cookie-cutter mass-market garbage but if it's so easy to do then why have literally all other attempts to replicate their success failed?
People like Cameron seem to forget that Marvel was rejected by every major studio. They didn't think you could make a good movie out of B-tier heroes like Iron Man, Captain America, and Thor. So Marvel studios bet the farm and made an independent student art film about a second-string superhero featuring a disgraced star on his way down to the gutter, and somehow won it all. Then just to flex on the whole business, they fucking went and made a movie about a giant talking tree man and a space racoon with 70s music and made a shitzillion more dollars.
Now since they've gone off classic Marvel in favor of woke comics they've been flopping. But to say their past success is some kind of fluke or only the result of spending money is sour fucking grapes.
Ah yes, war against....nebulous enemy of unspecified nationality.
It is exactly what the first movie is, and what Americans like: US comes in, kills the bad guy, and saves the day. It doesnt matter who or what it is, it doesnt prepare people for war with some nation. Its just that normal people like big explosions, hot jets, fast women, and "America, Ra Ra."
It may not be based. But its not woke or subversive either. It is just the possible last gasp of a Hollywood that still understood entertainment instead of propaganda.
And Cobra was actually right on a number of occasions. The Industrial War Machine is harmful, our communities are being abandoned, fiat currencies are horrid.
Technically, it is not my joke. I got it a long time ago from a semi-parody review of James Bond where the reviewer described part of the appeal as "Hot cars and fast women". So sometimes when I am giving a somewhat facetious answer to sometime like that, I will use the same terminology.
Not the mention the absurd Diversity Team that goes on the final mission. I mean the black guy and wahman both fucked up the training run and still got to go, FFS.
Its tiptoeing around the real issue, because he knows saying it out loud would probably get him on some shitlists and reveal the quiet part out loud to the masses.
Which is that the MCU heavily abused its interconnected nature to force you to see a lot of shitty movies that you wouldn't have because you needed that part of the story. Even if they ended up being irrelevant you wouldn't know that until well after. It was a builtin sunken cost fallacy that basically ensured nearly every pre-Infinity War movie was going to be successful. With the only necessary part sometimes being literally a small clip in the credits.
In reality a solid half of the movies likely wouldn't have stood on their own and kept riding on the promise of future ones.
Absolutely and now that infinity war has ended a lot of people jumped off the track. The Thanos saga had 23 films in it. 23! If you wanted to watch them all in a week that would be a full time job. A lot of people jumped off MCU’s dick and the shit they put out now isn’t going to pull them back in.
And of those 23, you only needed to watch maybe 10 to get the full picture. With everything else being fluff or just introducing a character with no further relevance ever brought up again.
For every Avengers, there was an Iron Man 2/3, Thor 1/2, Hulk, Antman 1/2, or Guardians 2. Heck even Black Panther is completely irrelevant and could have been accomplished with a single throwaway line elsewhere.
It's astonishing actually, the movie made tons of money yet their pop culture footprint is as deep as a puddle. The only one who parodied it I know is south park and that's about it. No one talks about the movie, no one cares about the story etc.
Avatar was just a fad because of the overhyped 3D at the time which was also a fad itself. Kind of funny though remembering it, this was during a time when even normies and leftists made fun of the movie for being woke with its cliched overly preachy story about natives vs colonizers, so maybe critics will be more generous this time.
Also I'm pretty sure superheroes sell more because they have decades of established fans, as well as international fame. This is like an indie game developer mad because Mario sells a lot.
Just started watching Avatar tonight. Never saw it. Starts off like cgi Pocahontas with anti whitism. The jarhead tribe, meanwhile the colonizers need the resources; must move natives theme. Got bored after 45 min. Did I give up too quick?
There's a couple good fanmade music videos with Avatar done over with the Savages song from Pocahontas. It works pretty much 1:1. Watch one, and you've basically gotten the entire movie experience, condensed into the 4 minutes or whatever long that song is time.
avatar - CGI ferngully - always sucked. Cameron just got lucky he was in the right place at the right time so his retarded movie with its shitty plot did huge numbers since he was able to dazzle retards with CGI and the 3d gimmick at the exact right time when CGI was advanced enough to be a big draw, and also new enough that people weren't used to it.
the new avatar is going to suck and it's going to fail. its plot will be recycled dog shit, and the CGI won't be able to wow anyone anymore because everyone's used to it. maybe the CGI can be a little better than whatever marvel/DC shit is being churned out at the same time, but the difference won't be big enough to blow audiences away and carry the movie to be some huge success.
Cameron clearly doesn't know what he's talking about if he's saying this. The whole reason people cared about the MCU was because it had interesting heroes with compelling journeys (before it went woke, anyway). You can't just feed people slop and expect your movies to succeed, they need more than that.
Then again, Cameron lost his credibility a long time ago. He called Terminator: Dark Fate the true sequel to Terminator 2 even though that movie gave John Connor the Luke Skywalker treatment.
I think there's little doubt that Avatar 2 (and the other sequels that for some godforsaken reason he's making) will not only be worse than the first movie, but they'll also be massive financial failures.
They could be just as big as the first movie and still be financial failures. Cameron has already admitted that this movie needs to make almost $2 BILLION...JUST TO BREAK EVEN!! And considering the metrics coming in are that it had a strong opening but is starting to fall off, just like every other movie with bad word of mouth...
Top Gun: Maverick already showed Hollywood that you can make billions of dollars, with almost nothing but the American box office (so you dont have to worry about China banning your movie), and have positive word of mouth, and all you have to do is give the people what they want in a movie and make something fun. It doesnt even need to break new ground, just not suck compared to the last.
That Hollywood continues to treat Top Gun like a pariah and hiss at its presence shows that their hatred is deliberate, and they would rather go bankrupt making movies that appeal to their personal bubble and let them sniff their own farts long before they make a movie that appeals to...ewwww "Normal people."
Kevin Feige pulled from the best story beats of 50+ years to make a modern retelling of classic comics. There, that's it. That's what he did.
People keep saying the MCU is just cookie-cutter mass-market garbage but if it's so easy to do then why have literally all other attempts to replicate their success failed?
People like Cameron seem to forget that Marvel was rejected by every major studio. They didn't think you could make a good movie out of B-tier heroes like Iron Man, Captain America, and Thor. So Marvel studios bet the farm and made an independent student art film about a second-string superhero featuring a disgraced star on his way down to the gutter, and somehow won it all. Then just to flex on the whole business, they fucking went and made a movie about a giant talking tree man and a space racoon with 70s music and made a shitzillion more dollars.
Now since they've gone off classic Marvel in favor of woke comics they've been flopping. But to say their past success is some kind of fluke or only the result of spending money is sour fucking grapes.
slams table THANK YOU!
True. If it was easy, Justice League would have been as good as Avengers.
2 Billion? Holy shit. That is not going to happen. Tbh i want more topgun type movies and no preachy shit.
Ah yes, war against....nebulous enemy of unspecified nationality.
It is exactly what the first movie is, and what Americans like: US comes in, kills the bad guy, and saves the day. It doesnt matter who or what it is, it doesnt prepare people for war with some nation. Its just that normal people like big explosions, hot jets, fast women, and "America, Ra Ra."
It may not be based. But its not woke or subversive either. It is just the possible last gasp of a Hollywood that still understood entertainment instead of propaganda.
Similar to GI Joe. COBRA was an easy adversary
And Cobra was actually right on a number of occasions. The Industrial War Machine is harmful, our communities are being abandoned, fiat currencies are horrid.
Damn that's all surreal now.
Wow, the old shows covered all that?
Yea show is surreal in what Cobra actually stands up for.
I need to do a rewatch
Hot jets and fast women? That's quite the imagery, there. I like it.
Technically, it is not my joke. I got it a long time ago from a semi-parody review of James Bond where the reviewer described part of the appeal as "Hot cars and fast women". So sometimes when I am giving a somewhat facetious answer to sometime like that, I will use the same terminology.
Not the mention the absurd Diversity Team that goes on the final mission. I mean the black guy and wahman both fucked up the training run and still got to go, FFS.
Did he ever address why he did that to John Connor? Or was it just the message?
Also at first the characters looked like they did in the comic books
Its tiptoeing around the real issue, because he knows saying it out loud would probably get him on some shitlists and reveal the quiet part out loud to the masses.
Which is that the MCU heavily abused its interconnected nature to force you to see a lot of shitty movies that you wouldn't have because you needed that part of the story. Even if they ended up being irrelevant you wouldn't know that until well after. It was a builtin sunken cost fallacy that basically ensured nearly every pre-Infinity War movie was going to be successful. With the only necessary part sometimes being literally a small clip in the credits.
In reality a solid half of the movies likely wouldn't have stood on their own and kept riding on the promise of future ones.
Absolutely and now that infinity war has ended a lot of people jumped off the track. The Thanos saga had 23 films in it. 23! If you wanted to watch them all in a week that would be a full time job. A lot of people jumped off MCU’s dick and the shit they put out now isn’t going to pull them back in.
And of those 23, you only needed to watch maybe 10 to get the full picture. With everything else being fluff or just introducing a character with no further relevance ever brought up again.
For every Avengers, there was an Iron Man 2/3, Thor 1/2, Hulk, Antman 1/2, or Guardians 2. Heck even Black Panther is completely irrelevant and could have been accomplished with a single throwaway line elsewhere.
Avatar is a completly forgettable movie, that only has rather nice looking cgi as it's redeeming quality.
Everything else in the movie has already been seen and done before.
It's astonishing actually, the movie made tons of money yet their pop culture footprint is as deep as a puddle. The only one who parodied it I know is south park and that's about it. No one talks about the movie, no one cares about the story etc.
Yes, but Disney built a Pandora area in it's Animal Kingdom. Got to justify it somehow.
Everything you just said also applies to most Marvel movies.
In most cases it pretty much applies to anything coming out of hollywood these days.
Alita: Battle Angel's going to be the last good movie he ever made, isn't it?
thought that was Robert Rodriguez
Avatar was just a fad because of the overhyped 3D at the time which was also a fad itself. Kind of funny though remembering it, this was during a time when even normies and leftists made fun of the movie for being woke with its cliched overly preachy story about natives vs colonizers, so maybe critics will be more generous this time.
Also I'm pretty sure superheroes sell more because they have decades of established fans, as well as international fame. This is like an indie game developer mad because Mario sells a lot.
Just started watching Avatar tonight. Never saw it. Starts off like cgi Pocahontas with anti whitism. The jarhead tribe, meanwhile the colonizers need the resources; must move natives theme. Got bored after 45 min. Did I give up too quick?
That won't change, the movie is frequently described as "Pocahontas/Dancing with Wolves starring blue smurfs".
There's a couple good fanmade music videos with Avatar done over with the Savages song from Pocahontas. It works pretty much 1:1. Watch one, and you've basically gotten the entire movie experience, condensed into the 4 minutes or whatever long that song is time.
Well since he's got four or five films he wants. Yea.
avatar - CGI ferngully - always sucked. Cameron just got lucky he was in the right place at the right time so his retarded movie with its shitty plot did huge numbers since he was able to dazzle retards with CGI and the 3d gimmick at the exact right time when CGI was advanced enough to be a big draw, and also new enough that people weren't used to it.
the new avatar is going to suck and it's going to fail. its plot will be recycled dog shit, and the CGI won't be able to wow anyone anymore because everyone's used to it. maybe the CGI can be a little better than whatever marvel/DC shit is being churned out at the same time, but the difference won't be big enough to blow audiences away and carry the movie to be some huge success.
Avatar Cinematic Universe?
"Unobtainium." 'Nuff said.
Maybe the real unobtainium was the film flops we made along the way.
Which instead of showing her growing with Strength Inside. She had fucking Magic Chi all along.
I thought it was because of big honking Iron Balls. Once that was lost, all was lost, Mr testosterone-bad.