Criminals don’t like citizens having the ability to stop them from harming you. Liberals believe that you should have to almost die in order to be justified in self defense.
In the Criminal Code of 1926 there was a most stupid Article 139—‘on the limits of necessary self-defense’—according to which you had the right to unsheath your knife only after the criminal's knife was hovering over you. And you could stab him only after he had stabbed you.
-Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn
Even in the Soviet Union what Jose Alba did would have been a clear case of self defense. Instead, in the modern United States, you have criminals being set free while responsible, law abiding citizens are harshly punished.
You misunderstand. The left isn't actually saying it isn't self defense. What they're really saying is that self defense shouldn't or doesn't exist, if you defend yourself from these violent apes.
Fundamentally, the issue here is proportionality. Like I said before, I think that what might have been said might have risen to the level of needing to use lethal force to defend himself. Maybe arguing that he's being moved to a secondary location, or that it's a strong armed robbery or a kidnapping, or that Simon said something about killing him, or Simon and the girlfriend said something about killing him.
It's not simply an issue of self-defense, it's about what kind of defense are you allowed to use when you defend yourself. Can you use lethal force in the face of ordinary force, and the answer is no. So, is there anyway this man can argue that he was facing lethal force? Yes, but that's the point. He's gonna be arguing it in front of a jury.
I already hear: "better judged by 12 than carried by 6", but was there enough information here to suggest that he was actually going to end up carried by 6?
And yes, unlike Kyle Rittenhouse, no one was trying to take Alba's gun, Alba didn't have one, he went and got a knife.
And yes, unlike Mike Brown, Simon didn't attack a police officer and try and take his gun, because Alba didn't have one.
Frankly, given the idiot girlfriend, he might have been more justified in stabbing her than Simon.
I think they are all great points, but I am going to play devils advocate here:
For the last two years, especially in massive cities like NYC, we have been dealing with and seeing situations were situations have gone 0-60 in an instant and people they thought where going to just simply assault them ended up becoming killers, usually because they were "disrespected" or some other stupid, pointless shit. And at the same time, these same locations have seen their police be kneecapped so that they can't actually enforce the laws as required.
So we have been seeing cases where people just do their own justice or defend themselves without really considering proportional force. Because they feel they have no options left so they need to take matters into their own hands.
And its why I like states like mine where the self-defense laws are extremely wide and the local culture favors self-defense. The example I always use was a local farmer shooting three burglars, killing two. And not only did he not get charged, not only did the sheriff issue him an award for "cleaning up the community", the surviving burglar was charged with the deaths on the grounds of "He is the one who convinced them it was a good idea, so its his fault they are dead." And a local jury said "Sounds reasonable. Guilty on all counts."
Now with all that said, I will admit that based on the video and the explanation from that defense expert you showed, I will admit that while I lean toward him being in the right on a gut level, I will admit that it is absolutely a dirty case and I wouldnt not be shocked if he was convicted of anything. Just that it feels wrong to me. Of course, if we actually went hard against crime and punished people to cut down on the crime rate and make it so that people didnt feel the need to escalate, we could avoid this all together. But that would mean and entire upending of the political order in NYC. And considering that that town has been corrupt for centuries by this point....
So we have been seeing cases where people just do their own justice or defend themselves without really considering proportional force. Because they feel they have no options left so they need to take matters into their own hands.
I don't disagree, the fact that there's been blowback to this in New York City, particularly after the continual violence of BLM's Kristalnacht in NYC in 2020, shows the kind of popular blowback that's happening.
The same thing happened in the 1970's with the emergence of Death Wish and Dirty Harry as a response to the unhindered criminality of the 1970's from the political left, who had actually engaged in a multiplicity of separatist actions and terror campaigns with the tacit support of the government from the political left.
Unfortunately, that's the problem we have here, and why I even go so far as to say lethal force to protect property should be legally permissible, even if it isn't the case now. Our moral consideration obscures the legal reality.
It's clear that what we see here is violent felons and their harpie villains asserting that they have an unlimited right to unlimited social violence without a single expectation of consequences. This situation is creating social blowback that would otherwise be considered unacceptable in a healthier society, but because we already know that there would never be a consequence to this violence (I think one of the news sources said this was the 5th knife attack in a bodega in NYC this month), we are prepared to accept a different level of violence that is educational in nature, even if legally incorrect.
Unfortunately, social problems can never be solved by the state, only worsened.
Incredible the way Tucker can make a video segment like this and NEVER ONCE MENTION the race of the attacker (the black dude assaulting a 60+ year old man).
The man does that and still gets called a huwhite supreme.
Is there any point in holding back if you wind up getting smeared anyway?
What good is posturing for optics when the folks with the cameras are controlling the frame? You can only minimize potential damage, not look good.
I get that Tucker wants the high ground, morally, which means he's obliged to be a color-blind conservative, but you can't address another incident adding to the black crime rate without addressing race.
He winds up decrying the symptom, while ignoring the disease.
The most visibly disgusted I've seen someone be over a bunch of young black men act like hoodrats was from a black man in the 40-60 range.
These guys were in a Taco Bell shouting and hollering about "monkey punching" using various other curse words. The older black guy had the most disgusted look on his face looking at these kids, then he got out of line without ordering and left.
I stuck around, and before my food* even came they were gone and I got to eat in peace.
The commies at Gofundme cancelled the fundraiser that was started for him.
GiveSendGo has stepped up - https://www.givesendgo.com/site/search?text=Jose%20Alba
Not sure why people still use Gofundme.
They lost all credibility when they caved to Trudeau and closed the trucker's fundraiser of 10 million in February.
They originally announced they weren't even going to refund the money back to donors.
They initially announced they'd award the monies to a charity of THEIR choice.
Go Fund Me is ridiculous
Now imagine how much damage Google’s AI + Facebook + Twitter can do when acting on the democrat party’s desires
BTW the video is poorly edited to make it look like Jose Alba was quick to resort to violence.
Here's the original video, where you can see that he was plenty patient with this thug: https://youtu.be/ibbe0k8dLsw?t=112
I don’t know how this isn’t self defense. One rule I follow is don’t beat ppl up if I don’t want things to escalate. Michael Brown anyone?
Criminals don’t like citizens having the ability to stop them from harming you. Liberals believe that you should have to almost die in order to be justified in self defense.
Yea I notice they have a very high bar for self defense
-Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn
Even in the Soviet Union what Jose Alba did would have been a clear case of self defense. Instead, in the modern United States, you have criminals being set free while responsible, law abiding citizens are harshly punished.
You misunderstand. The left isn't actually saying it isn't self defense. What they're really saying is that self defense shouldn't or doesn't exist, if you defend yourself from these violent apes.
I made a long explanation, but I lost it.
Basically, ASP explains it better than I can.
Fundamentally, the issue here is proportionality. Like I said before, I think that what might have been said might have risen to the level of needing to use lethal force to defend himself. Maybe arguing that he's being moved to a secondary location, or that it's a strong armed robbery or a kidnapping, or that Simon said something about killing him, or Simon and the girlfriend said something about killing him.
It's not simply an issue of self-defense, it's about what kind of defense are you allowed to use when you defend yourself. Can you use lethal force in the face of ordinary force, and the answer is no. So, is there anyway this man can argue that he was facing lethal force? Yes, but that's the point. He's gonna be arguing it in front of a jury.
I already hear: "better judged by 12 than carried by 6", but was there enough information here to suggest that he was actually going to end up carried by 6?
And yes, unlike Kyle Rittenhouse, no one was trying to take Alba's gun, Alba didn't have one, he went and got a knife.
And yes, unlike Mike Brown, Simon didn't attack a police officer and try and take his gun, because Alba didn't have one.
Frankly, given the idiot girlfriend, he might have been more justified in stabbing her than Simon.
I think they are all great points, but I am going to play devils advocate here:
For the last two years, especially in massive cities like NYC, we have been dealing with and seeing situations were situations have gone 0-60 in an instant and people they thought where going to just simply assault them ended up becoming killers, usually because they were "disrespected" or some other stupid, pointless shit. And at the same time, these same locations have seen their police be kneecapped so that they can't actually enforce the laws as required.
So we have been seeing cases where people just do their own justice or defend themselves without really considering proportional force. Because they feel they have no options left so they need to take matters into their own hands.
And its why I like states like mine where the self-defense laws are extremely wide and the local culture favors self-defense. The example I always use was a local farmer shooting three burglars, killing two. And not only did he not get charged, not only did the sheriff issue him an award for "cleaning up the community", the surviving burglar was charged with the deaths on the grounds of "He is the one who convinced them it was a good idea, so its his fault they are dead." And a local jury said "Sounds reasonable. Guilty on all counts."
Now with all that said, I will admit that based on the video and the explanation from that defense expert you showed, I will admit that while I lean toward him being in the right on a gut level, I will admit that it is absolutely a dirty case and I wouldnt not be shocked if he was convicted of anything. Just that it feels wrong to me. Of course, if we actually went hard against crime and punished people to cut down on the crime rate and make it so that people didnt feel the need to escalate, we could avoid this all together. But that would mean and entire upending of the political order in NYC. And considering that that town has been corrupt for centuries by this point....
I don't disagree, the fact that there's been blowback to this in New York City, particularly after the continual violence of BLM's Kristalnacht in NYC in 2020, shows the kind of popular blowback that's happening.
The same thing happened in the 1970's with the emergence of Death Wish and Dirty Harry as a response to the unhindered criminality of the 1970's from the political left, who had actually engaged in a multiplicity of separatist actions and terror campaigns with the tacit support of the government from the political left.
Unfortunately, that's the problem we have here, and why I even go so far as to say lethal force to protect property should be legally permissible, even if it isn't the case now. Our moral consideration obscures the legal reality.
It's clear that what we see here is violent felons and their harpie villains asserting that they have an unlimited right to unlimited social violence without a single expectation of consequences. This situation is creating social blowback that would otherwise be considered unacceptable in a healthier society, but because we already know that there would never be a consequence to this violence (I think one of the news sources said this was the 5th knife attack in a bodega in NYC this month), we are prepared to accept a different level of violence that is educational in nature, even if legally incorrect.
Unfortunately, social problems can never be solved by the state, only worsened.
Good points.
Incredible the way Tucker can make a video segment like this and NEVER ONCE MENTION the race of the attacker (the black dude assaulting a 60+ year old man).
The man does that and still gets called a huwhite supreme.
Is there any point in holding back if you wind up getting smeared anyway?
What good is posturing for optics when the folks with the cameras are controlling the frame? You can only minimize potential damage, not look good.
I get that Tucker wants the high ground, morally, which means he's obliged to be a color-blind conservative, but you can't address another incident adding to the black crime rate without addressing race.
He winds up decrying the symptom, while ignoring the disease.
The most visibly disgusted I've seen someone be over a bunch of young black men act like hoodrats was from a black man in the 40-60 range.
These guys were in a Taco Bell shouting and hollering about "monkey punching" using various other curse words. The older black guy had the most disgusted look on his face looking at these kids, then he got out of line without ordering and left.
I stuck around, and before my food* even came they were gone and I got to eat in peace.
Some black people know. Like really, truly know.
He did allude to it though. He said that you have no self-respect when your attacker belongs to a politically favored group.
Fucking called it.
Someone who acts like that doesn't suddenly start at age 37.
You could have known that from him being black.
So now Hispanic (like from literal Hispañola) immigrants aren't good enough for them?
Democrats want to incite violence among their base.
They hate hispanics and hate workers.
Biden will be angry if he loses the Hispanic vote :
“if you don’t vote for me, then you ain’t hispanic”
I love how he put those three corporate lowlifes on display.
For too long, they've just been able to do whatever they want without any backlash.