We know from past experience that it will never be portrayed as "nefarious". They will cover it up as long as possible and say anything you found on 4chan was Russian disinformation.
Then when it's no longer possible to hide they'll put out headlines like "Ukraine and America, Partners in Biowarfare Deterrence: Here's Why That's a Good Thing".
My dude, the Americans predicted this exact sort of Russian propaganda over a month ago. Like the rest of their publicly relased predictions that came true (there will be the full scale offensive in February, it will look exactly like that with a missile barrage immediately followed by attacks from these directions, it will be preceded by a string of fake videos, there will be ABC allegations), because the intel was just that good.
Remember that? Sure you do. There were several threads here laughing about that, and yet it turned out to be all true.
One of the few predictions still to come: "terrorist bombings" in Moscow (again). Don't act surprised when it ever so suddenly happens.
Not even Ukraine did believe it. Not even when the Americans through Biden personally announced it begins in the next 48 hours (it did within 24), PreZ himself would continue to be in public denial while the Russians have already began painting their Z markings.
Threads like https://kotakuinaction2.win/p/141rjRR19B/nbc-according-to-a-us-official-a/ (article from February 20: "The U.S. has picked up intelligence showing that Russian military officials were given an order to go ahead with an invasion of Ukraine", which was proven accurate too). There was a whole lot of them but somehow it's no longer talked about when it was proven true, and no mea culpa came from anyone involved in posting them (many of them were hit-and-run handshake accounts, but anyway).
Another one for example, https://kotakuinaction2.win/p/141YNG1Wu9/we-have-declassified-the-informa/ The videos did come, weeks later, even as they declassified the intelligence about them publicly specifically to deterrent the Russian side from making and releasing the fake videos. They made and effort to point out the purpose of the declassifion as just that (the detterence, which didn't work, all the Russian plans went ahead with no changes except 8 days of initial delay, originally the attack was slated Feb 16 - now it's clear they still weren't ready and it was premature).
Now, do you think they can't fabricate some pieces of paper? Are you really so guilible? What happened with you that you're so ready to believe some propaganda photos that you can't even read? The Russians must be amazed about the current mental state of the Americans, you're just so completely broken. Maybe I should remind you Russia Today's own motto and actually a pretty good advice for you, "question everything".
It's hilarious how suddenly you guys became concerned about the N-word allegations. It really is.
But in any case, RS isn't a "nazi group" unless you're Antifa or a literal Chekist. They identify with the UPA tradition and the UPA killed quite some Germans and frustrated their war effort (slavery deportations and food requisitions) during WWII.
Anyways of course the RS militia (Ukrainian Volunteer Corps, reactivated) will have NATO weapons, the entire country is now awashed with them, being supplied openly and very publicly, even the Russians captured some already. I don't even care did they really capture any "headquarters", why do you think this could be newsworthy now? It would be interesting if they somehow didn't have them (for some strange reason). The Russians don't even need to plant them now, as they did with these airsoft rifles at Donetsk Airport back in the day (it was very weird).
The Americans armed the actual-actual "Nazis" in Croatia (the Ustase tradition, who unlike the UPA never fought against the Germans) and today they're rather marginal in Croatia, just very colorful. And some of these guys actually just went to Ukraine to fight for the right side of history.
When Croatia relied most for the "right side of the history" extreme in the neo-Ustase groups, they fought "the left side of the history" represented by the Based Sebs with still red stars everywhere (flags, vehicles, helmets). The Americans later armed the Croats with their Vietnam era uniforms and weapons, enabling the "Nazis" to win the war (also in Bosnia after going in there).
Quotation marks due to the very special audience of the aut-right, easily fascinated.
You guys can't really see an obvious pun, the one that I've been using so many times before? So damn autismal even after already explained?
Maybe I should explain more clearly, just for you terminal autists: The joke > "The right side of history means the right-wing side of history, as opposed to the left (wing) side of history". < The joke.
Whatever even is this "globohom"? Was it also fighting "globohom" when the Soviets fought the Ukrainian nationalists in the 1940s and 1950s? Was it for "globohom" even when the UPA embarked on to exterminate the Polish minority in Volhynia?
Nah, they're serious in their "Nazism". It's not any LARP when you kill and die.
"Russian peacekepeers" isn't anything new at all, it was first used in early 1992 in Moldova when freshly rebranded Soviet forces whose tanks under General Lebed rescued the local seps from "the fascists" (the police) and since then they have remained there to this day.
They were already in place since 1945, as the Soviet 14th Army (became the Russian 14th Army).
Transdnestria seps still use the hammer and sickle symbol in their flag. Everything is at least as Soviet as in 1990. Can't wait to hear from the "far right" crowd over here about how based they are if the denaZification of Moldova campaign begins next.
Who are the tards downvoting an answer to a simple question?
I think it's not about ideology. I support Putin preventing NATO from coming into Ukraine in order to end Western hegemony, which I think is very destructive.
NATO was never coming to Ukraine. If you mean membership, not only NATO wasn't interested (besides some lobbying countries, chiefly Poland) but just the ongoing conflict with no end in sight over Donbas and Crimea would ensure it wouldn't happen in any case.
And not even after MH17 when their civilians were massacred did NATO do anything about it. I actually expected a peacemaking force at the time, or at least a massive support, but no. Nothing happened.
But in any case, RS isn't a "nazi group" unless you're Antifa or a literal Chekist. They identify with the UPA tradition and the UPA killed quite some Germans and frustrated their war effort (slavery deportations and food requisitions) during WWII.
they're serious in their "Nazism". It's not any LARP
I'm confused by these statements, despite the quotation marks.
"Nazism" here is just a Russian buzzword and a Russian neologism at that. Until just several years ago they would only ever use "fascism", as in for example to say that "the fascist Germany attacked the White Polish fascists in 1939" (and they still use "White Poland" or "White Finland" because they forever see everything through the prism of their own civil war, and also every foreign enemy was either "fascist" or "imperialist", or at least the latter's local "lackey").
This is also why they called it "Antifa" and not "Antina" when the Komintern organized it in Germany 1932. The targets of Antifa were both "Hitler's fascists" and the "social fascists" (the Social Democrats).
Anyways the RS guys are really into hardcore Ukrainian nationalism, namely they're neo-Banderovites of the UPA tradition (albeit not nearly anywhere as extreme as the UPA have been historically). For which they are killing and dying as we speak, such is this LARP full of accidents.
interesting. poisoning an enemy is a very feminine way of attacking and destroying. NATO and the West are both run by women. It's a reasonable concern for those in Russia who want peace.
Ehhh - I don't buy this one. 48 hour rule. I don't think Putin was invading just to take out the "biowarfare" centers either.
it's certainly plausible given that Obama already moved biowarfare research of one type to China to avoid US laws that he and Biden would easily do it in Ukraine too under the guise of "studying cures for Anthrax" but I highly doubt that it was actually being produced there in any amount of consequence.
In his TV appearance preceding the invasion he did mention the claims, not as the reason for attacking but as kind of a "by the way" when talking about how a NATO-Ukraine alliance is dangerous for Russians.
There was "chemical warfare" propaganda just before the attack, like this hilariously fake (with sound effects from a 2012 Finnish military training on YT) video of "Polish speaking saboteurs killed while trying to blow up a chlorine tank" in like Donbas, and another very half-assed provocation in Crimea involving a chemical plant or whatever. It just quickly become forgotten as they try throwing ever other shit on the wall non stop.
That's my position as well. I could totally believe it, but Russia is known for pulling these fake propaganda stunts and their government culture didn't magically change with the fall of the Soviet Union. What they've been for decades is what the US is becoming. We would need independent verification, but somehow they'll conveniently destroy the "labs" before that can happen.
This humorous Breitbart piece brought those claims up while trying to convince the reader that ITs beEn DebOnKeD, with all the believability of MSM telling us the 2020 US election was fortified to be the bestest evar.
I originally thought it was nothing but a 4chan LARP, but this lame excuse for a cover-up made me believe it more.
Russia has been spreading wild claims of American biological warfare labs in Ukraine for several years. Those claims were eagerly boosted by Chinese state media, which mixed them with Beijing’s deranged conspiracy theory about the Wuhan coronavirus originating in a U.S. Army lab in Maryland.
On Thursday, the same day Russian leader Vladimir Putin ordered the attack on Ukraine, Russian propaganda outlets circulated a map purportedly showing dozens of secret American labs across Ukraine, with 11 of them already targeted and destroyed by Russian missiles.
International media organizations debunked the Russian claims and noted Russia has been running disinformation campaigns accusing the U.S. of manufacturing chemical and biological weapons in Ukraine for years. The Russian tale was fabricated out of an agreement between the U.S. and Ukraine to modernize Ukrainian virology labs, some of which are dedicated to defense against weaponized pathogens.
I have a feeling we are dealing with Russia/China first brigade here, and not America first.
Imagine believing the propaganda the Russians and Chinese sell.
Whether it's true or not is not ultimately the point.
The problem is that it's totally believable. Accusing the US of secretly developing bioweapons should be the equivalent of accusing Mr. Rogers of diddling kids -- a complete joke that nobody would entertain for even a second.
Instead everybody is like, "it sounds Faucian but it's coming from Russian, so who knows". Even if you completely believe it's Russian propaganda, it still highlights the West's lack of credibility and no moral standing because you're dismissing it because it came from Russia not because it's ludicrous.
Russia has been spreading wild claims of American biological warfare labs
Not journalism.
Beijing’s deranged conspiracy theory
Not journalism.
International media organizations debunked the Russian claims
Not journalism.
The Russian tale was fabricated
Not journalism.
an agreement between the U.S. and Ukraine to modernize Ukrainian virology labs, some of which are dedicated to defense against weaponized pathogens
100% Grade A bullshit, coated with some turd polish to make it shiny and distracting.
I don't even know if the Russian propaganda is true or not (they fake enough "evidence" to make everything they say suspect) but if you can't see what's going on here, at Breitbart and many other western media operations, I don't know how to explain it. You basically already parroted this rhetoric in your other reply to me about disease research below, so I think you have some kind of barrier to understanding here. (again not speaking to which of us is telling the truth or not, but the reasoning process)
And if we were being "America First" we would mosey on out of all these international engagements and treaties. Not our problem, and we'd gain more from a friendly economic relationship with Russia. We just wouldn't want them to dominate us like China.
, at Breitbart and many other western media operations, I don't know how to explain it.
I find them slightly more credible than Russia. Especially Breitbart, which I find it more credible than CNN.
We just wouldn't want them to dominate us like China.
Then explain the amount of pro-China sentiment that began flooding here recently.
I wish Russia would have joined us against China. I find this war pointless and unnecessary and just a power grab by a failing dictator. But defending Russia here despite the blatant information pointing to their failings (massive censorship, massive lies, massive violations of many rules and laws) is just retarded.
To make a point, I only shared the videos about the airplane crashes and helicopter being shot down after I read it from a more credible source. And not as soon as it came out from the Ukrainian government.
And just so you know... The books I have on my shelf is from my biology degree. I had classes about lab safety over and over. So I think I am entitled to know a thing or two about this.
Research on disease is very different from weaponized research on disease. And anything coming out of Ukraine itself I doubt it, but anything coming out Russia I doubt it even more.
Research on disease is very different from weaponized research on disease
Wuhan says Hello.
Like with nuclear research, anything that you can use for peaceful research (no idea that is in this context) can be reworked into weaponry. You would really need an international team of inspectors to verify. And obviously "international" would have to include Russia.
I agree, monitoring by international organizations is needed. But one can not stop the research of disease. There is still a lot we do not know about many viruses and bacteria out there(Even to those we already know a lot). And we need the research.
Plus, I trust more on Ukrainian scientist than a Chinese scientist in Wuhan.
Because they too can do research in there. Just like Russia also does research. You do know Russia owns one of the last strains of smallpox left in the world, right? If we use your logic, Russia shouldn't even own that last strain.
We know from past experience that it will never be portrayed as "nefarious". They will cover it up as long as possible and say anything you found on 4chan was Russian disinformation.
Then when it's no longer possible to hide they'll put out headlines like "Ukraine and America, Partners in Biowarfare Deterrence: Here's Why That's a Good Thing".
My dude, the Americans predicted this exact sort of Russian propaganda over a month ago. Like the rest of their publicly relased predictions that came true (there will be the full scale offensive in February, it will look exactly like that with a missile barrage immediately followed by attacks from these directions, it will be preceded by a string of fake videos, there will be ABC allegations), because the intel was just that good.
Remember that? Sure you do. There were several threads here laughing about that, and yet it turned out to be all true.
One of the few predictions still to come: "terrorist bombings" in Moscow (again). Don't act surprised when it ever so suddenly happens.
It's the "Boy Who Cried Wolf."
Not even Ukraine did believe it. Not even when the Americans through Biden personally announced it begins in the next 48 hours (it did within 24), PreZ himself would continue to be in public denial while the Russians have already began painting their Z markings.
I do wonder if the Ukraine government believed it. We'll never know. This whole thing is full of gayops.
They also gave an earlier date for the invasion which fell through. Very Nostradamus-like.
It was delayed just 8 days (and still was launched not ready). They next announced a week later it's coming in the next 48 hours and it did.
After many months of preparations ("just training exercises").
Look I don’t know if this story is credible or not but what you’re describing is called “front-running” or “pre-bunking.” It’s a little suspicious.
True, the degree to which Putin has coordinated globohomo for this show is immaculate.
Threads like https://kotakuinaction2.win/p/141rjRR19B/nbc-according-to-a-us-official-a/ (article from February 20: "The U.S. has picked up intelligence showing that Russian military officials were given an order to go ahead with an invasion of Ukraine", which was proven accurate too). There was a whole lot of them but somehow it's no longer talked about when it was proven true, and no mea culpa came from anyone involved in posting them (many of them were hit-and-run handshake accounts, but anyway).
Another one for example, https://kotakuinaction2.win/p/141YNG1Wu9/we-have-declassified-the-informa/ The videos did come, weeks later, even as they declassified the intelligence about them publicly specifically to deterrent the Russian side from making and releasing the fake videos. They made and effort to point out the purpose of the declassifion as just that (the detterence, which didn't work, all the Russian plans went ahead with no changes except 8 days of initial delay, originally the attack was slated Feb 16 - now it's clear they still weren't ready and it was premature).
Now, do you think they can't fabricate some pieces of paper? Are you really so guilible? What happened with you that you're so ready to believe some propaganda photos that you can't even read? The Russians must be amazed about the current mental state of the Americans, you're just so completely broken. Maybe I should remind you Russia Today's own motto and actually a pretty good advice for you, "question everything".
It's hilarious how suddenly you guys became concerned about the N-word allegations. It really is.
But in any case, RS isn't a "nazi group" unless you're Antifa or a literal Chekist. They identify with the UPA tradition and the UPA killed quite some Germans and frustrated their war effort (slavery deportations and food requisitions) during WWII.
Anyways of course the RS militia (Ukrainian Volunteer Corps, reactivated) will have NATO weapons, the entire country is now awashed with them, being supplied openly and very publicly, even the Russians captured some already. I don't even care did they really capture any "headquarters", why do you think this could be newsworthy now? It would be interesting if they somehow didn't have them (for some strange reason). The Russians don't even need to plant them now, as they did with these airsoft rifles at Donetsk Airport back in the day (it was very weird).
We're "concerned" because the globalists have made n-words their perpetual boogeyman and suddenly we see them arming/supplying Actual n-words.
And perhaps not just some, as Russia even accused hundreds of Croats to be heading to Ukraine, to join the hundreds allegedly already there: https://balkaninsight.com/2022/03/04/russia-summons-croatian-attache-over-reports-of-mercenaries-in-ukraine/
(They're not "mercenaries", it's how enemy foreign fighters are always called by Russia.)
Croatia also sends weapons. Maybe even including the old American weapons from the war, but probably not because "We are talking about rifles and machine guns with the calibres requested by the Ukrainian side". Or maybe actually the VHS-2 and such, who knows.
The Americans armed the actual-actual "Nazis" in Croatia (the Ustase tradition, who unlike the UPA never fought against the Germans) and today they're rather marginal in Croatia, just very colorful. And some of these guys actually just went to Ukraine to fight for the right side of history.
It's baffling how much of a committed liberal you are after all of your time here.
I personally find it fascinating
Be fascinated further: https://kotakuinaction2.win/p/142AwFZZu0/x/c/4OUhcJXtATE
I'm sorry there's no cure for autism.
When Croatia relied most for the "right side of the history" extreme in the neo-Ustase groups, they fought "the left side of the history" represented by the Based Sebs with still red stars everywhere (flags, vehicles, helmets). The Americans later armed the Croats with their Vietnam era uniforms and weapons, enabling the "Nazis" to win the war (also in Bosnia after going in there).
Quotation marks due to the very special audience of the aut-right, easily fascinated.
You guys can't really see an obvious pun, the one that I've been using so many times before? So damn autismal even after already explained?
Maybe I should explain more clearly, just for you terminal autists: The joke > "The right side of history means the right-wing side of history, as opposed to the left (wing) side of history". < The joke.
The joke makes no sense in this context unless you think globohom is right-wing. Also, you're still a liberal regardless.
Whatever even is this "globohom"? Was it also fighting "globohom" when the Soviets fought the Ukrainian nationalists in the 1940s and 1950s? Was it for "globohom" even when the UPA embarked on to exterminate the Polish minority in Volhynia?
🤮
As opposed to the left side of history!
(You know, like the Chekist tradition.)
Nah, they're serious in their "Nazism". It's not any LARP when you kill and die.
"Russian peacekepeers" isn't anything new at all, it was first used in early 1992 in Moldova when freshly rebranded Soviet forces whose tanks under General Lebed rescued the local seps from "the fascists" (the police) and since then they have remained there to this day.
How did they even get there? Through Ukraine?
They were already in place since 1945, as the Soviet 14th Army (became the Russian 14th Army).
Transdnestria seps still use the hammer and sickle symbol in their flag. Everything is at least as Soviet as in 1990. Can't wait to hear from the "far right" crowd over here about how based they are if the denaZification of Moldova campaign begins next.
Who are the tards downvoting an answer to a simple question?
I think it's not about ideology. I support Putin preventing NATO from coming into Ukraine in order to end Western hegemony, which I think is very destructive.
NATO was never coming to Ukraine. If you mean membership, not only NATO wasn't interested (besides some lobbying countries, chiefly Poland) but just the ongoing conflict with no end in sight over Donbas and Crimea would ensure it wouldn't happen in any case.
And not even after MH17 when their civilians were massacred did NATO do anything about it. I actually expected a peacemaking force at the time, or at least a massive support, but no. Nothing happened.
I'm confused by these statements, despite the quotation marks.
"Nazism" here is just a Russian buzzword and a Russian neologism at that. Until just several years ago they would only ever use "fascism", as in for example to say that "the fascist Germany attacked the White Polish fascists in 1939" (and they still use "White Poland" or "White Finland" because they forever see everything through the prism of their own civil war, and also every foreign enemy was either "fascist" or "imperialist", or at least the latter's local "lackey").
This is also why they called it "Antifa" and not "Antina" when the Komintern organized it in Germany 1932. The targets of Antifa were both "Hitler's fascists" and the "social fascists" (the Social Democrats).
Anyways the RS guys are really into hardcore Ukrainian nationalism, namely they're neo-Banderovites of the UPA tradition (albeit not nearly anywhere as extreme as the UPA have been historically). For which they are killing and dying as we speak, such is this LARP full of accidents.
interesting. poisoning an enemy is a very feminine way of attacking and destroying. NATO and the West are both run by women. It's a reasonable concern for those in Russia who want peace.
Welcome back Imp!
"Poison is a woman's weapon. And a eunuch's."
Oy vey!
Allegedly.
I love how the two sides dismiss everything bad about their own side as 'war propaganda' but uncritically echo what is to their advantage.
Ehhh - I don't buy this one. 48 hour rule. I don't think Putin was invading just to take out the "biowarfare" centers either. it's certainly plausible given that Obama already moved biowarfare research of one type to China to avoid US laws that he and Biden would easily do it in Ukraine too under the guise of "studying cures for Anthrax" but I highly doubt that it was actually being produced there in any amount of consequence.
Why wouldn't Putin come out in the first place and say they invaded to destroy the biolabs instead of their current "denazification" narrative?
In his TV appearance preceding the invasion he did mention the claims, not as the reason for attacking but as kind of a "by the way" when talking about how a NATO-Ukraine alliance is dangerous for Russians.
There was "chemical warfare" propaganda just before the attack, like this hilariously fake (with sound effects from a 2012 Finnish military training on YT) video of "Polish speaking saboteurs killed while trying to blow up a chlorine tank" in like Donbas, and another very half-assed provocation in Crimea involving a chemical plant or whatever. It just quickly become forgotten as they try throwing ever other shit on the wall non stop.
that sounds far too convenient to be true.
That's my position as well. I could totally believe it, but Russia is known for pulling these fake propaganda stunts and their government culture didn't magically change with the fall of the Soviet Union. What they've been for decades is what the US is becoming. We would need independent verification, but somehow they'll conveniently destroy the "labs" before that can happen.
This humorous Breitbart piece brought those claims up while trying to convince the reader that ITs beEn DebOnKeD, with all the believability of MSM telling us the 2020 US election was fortified to be the bestest evar.
I originally thought it was nothing but a 4chan LARP, but this lame excuse for a cover-up made me believe it more.
I have a feeling we are dealing with Russia/China first brigade here, and not America first.
Imagine believing the propaganda the Russians and Chinese sell.
Whether it's true or not is not ultimately the point.
The problem is that it's totally believable. Accusing the US of secretly developing bioweapons should be the equivalent of accusing Mr. Rogers of diddling kids -- a complete joke that nobody would entertain for even a second.
Instead everybody is like, "it sounds Faucian but it's coming from Russian, so who knows". Even if you completely believe it's Russian propaganda, it still highlights the West's lack of credibility and no moral standing because you're dismissing it because it came from Russia not because it's ludicrous.
Would you believe if America said the same thing about Russia? Would you dismiss it because it came from America or was it because it is ludicrous?
Yes both Russia and America can easily be believed to have secretly created bioweapons.
That's the point actually, we have no moral high ground on this issue and we should.
Not journalism.
Not journalism.
Not journalism.
Not journalism.
100% Grade A bullshit, coated with some turd polish to make it shiny and distracting.
I don't even know if the Russian propaganda is true or not (they fake enough "evidence" to make everything they say suspect) but if you can't see what's going on here, at Breitbart and many other western media operations, I don't know how to explain it. You basically already parroted this rhetoric in your other reply to me about disease research below, so I think you have some kind of barrier to understanding here. (again not speaking to which of us is telling the truth or not, but the reasoning process)
And if we were being "America First" we would mosey on out of all these international engagements and treaties. Not our problem, and we'd gain more from a friendly economic relationship with Russia. We just wouldn't want them to dominate us like China.
Glad you shared evidence that this is all BS.
I find them slightly more credible than Russia. Especially Breitbart, which I find it more credible than CNN.
Then explain the amount of pro-China sentiment that began flooding here recently.
I wish Russia would have joined us against China. I find this war pointless and unnecessary and just a power grab by a failing dictator. But defending Russia here despite the blatant information pointing to their failings (massive censorship, massive lies, massive violations of many rules and laws) is just retarded.
To make a point, I only shared the videos about the airplane crashes and helicopter being shot down after I read it from a more credible source. And not as soon as it came out from the Ukrainian government.
And just so you know... The books I have on my shelf is from my biology degree. I had classes about lab safety over and over. So I think I am entitled to know a thing or two about this.
The "Gulf War Uno Reverse." :[
Oh, because that gives permission for Putin to rape white women and kill white men in Ukraine then. Believe the Kremlin, Move along...
Research on disease is very different from weaponized research on disease. And anything coming out of Ukraine itself I doubt it, but anything coming out Russia I doubt it even more.
So, pressing X here.
Wuhan says Hello.
Like with nuclear research, anything that you can use for peaceful research (no idea that is in this context) can be reworked into weaponry. You would really need an international team of inspectors to verify. And obviously "international" would have to include Russia.
I agree, monitoring by international organizations is needed. But one can not stop the research of disease. There is still a lot we do not know about many viruses and bacteria out there(Even to those we already know a lot). And we need the research.
Plus, I trust more on Ukrainian scientist than a Chinese scientist in Wuhan.
Are you guys seriously thinking so about Europe lmao
Because they too can do research in there. Just like Russia also does research. You do know Russia owns one of the last strains of smallpox left in the world, right? If we use your logic, Russia shouldn't even own that last strain.
Not my fault if you lack basic knowledge about how things work and the real world.
Let me just go delete the knowledge of Russian retaining the last strain of smallpox out of my head to protect your fragile feefees.
I agree, explaining to you is a massive waste of effort and time. What I said is basic knowledge, not even requiring university level biology.