I think you might be missing the forest for the trees with this, as this article suggests that the tariffs might be an ideological test too.
If a company has competent leadership, they'll just begin looking at an American property to base out of to escape tariffs.
If they are ideologically captured and need to scream how they hate the far right and want to kill Trump, they'll raise prices lowering their sales and slowly lose business to more competitive, probably US based companies, depending on product.
That's political rhetoric. Mercedes is already building some cars here in S. Carolina. However, you can't just build a factory and move production overnight. Trump also only has four years, so what's really the goal here? Everything points to Trump using the tariffs as a negotiating tool to get something else from the E.U., but he needs to make it quick. Americans don't like American cars, so these tariffs are also hurting all the Americans employed to sell and service foreign cars.
Trump should also exempt countries like Hungary from the tariffs. Orbán is Trump's BIGGEST supporter in Europe, and he's taken shit for it too. Mercedes and Audi build lots of cars there and it's a big part of Orbáns economy. Once again, Trump hurts those who support him most. These tariffs really are indiscriminate fire and don't show any sign that Trump and Co. know what they're really doing.
However, you can't just build a factory and move production overnight.
Trump's a businessman. Show you're investing money, show you have legitimate plans to start US production, and you'll likely dodge the tariffs. And get a publicity bump as Trump tells everyone how great and patriotic you are. Which may or may not be a good thing, depending on your customers' average political leanings, I suppose.
Brands like Mercedes, VW/ Audi, BMW, Toyota, Hyundia, etc. ALREADY build at around half their models in N. America. What more is there to do? There are more American-built parts in the Toyota Tundra than the F150 or Silverado. There tariffs are indiscriminate and irresponsible. Nobody sees the "endgame" here and Trump won't say either. It's only been three months and I'm already beyond disappointed with this old man impersonating Trump '16.
There are more American-built parts in the Toyota Tundra than the F150 or Silverado.
Correct. I'm not sure about Mercedes and Porsche but, if true, I agree it could be handled better.
Considering the posturing of Germany and much of the rest of Europe, I'm also not going to cry about it, though. They'll probably talk big and refuse to make concessions, which will further embolden groups like the AfD, I'd imagine.
Nobody sees the "endgame" here and Trump won't say either.
Uh, he's said it repeatedly. Equalizing tariffs, and bringing back more manufacturing and investment to the US. And it's working, so far. Many companies, including Toyota as you mentioned, are increasing production in the US.
Yes, prices will go up in the short term, but it's encouraging more money to be kept and focused domestically, and I think that's a good thing. It is America first, and it is helping escape from globalism.
It also helps solidify friend/enemy distinction when retard countries like Canada and Germany can't get out of their own way and keep attacking the US while wanting stuff from us.
It's only been three months and I'm already beyond disappointed with this old man impersonating Trump '16.
I'm disappointed and worried about quite a few things...and ecstatic about others. Trump 24 overperformed on many issues, and it's amazing. Shame about the current war posturing, and the massive percentage of not just Zionists, but ulta-Zionists in his cabinet, though.
Trump isn't failing though. He's carrying on the status quo in some arenas (unfortunately), doing really good work in others, and doing bad things in others as well. It's a mixed bag, but overall better than our other options, or other recent presidents.
Where are the parts to make the car built? It's not about where you 'assemble' the cars but where the parts for the car are actually made.
Are all the parts made in the USA? I doubt it. They get parts made overseas then assemble them in America and claim "it's built in America" when actually the car was built in pieces somewhere else and ASSEMBLED in America. There's no manufacturing in America to make all those parts. But there will be.
There isn't ANY car that's made 100% in any one country. Not even China, which needs to import things like chips for the infotainment and sensors. You're just being a jackass, like 98% of the other comments here.
Japan has been hit by tarrifs, though I'm betting not for long. There will be back and forth negotiations as these are reciprocal tariffs so applying the rates they apply to the US back at them.
If the first move they can think of is raise prices, chances are THEY aren't open to negotiations so screw them.
Trump should also exempt countries like Hungary from the tariffs.
Exempting Hungary or any other EU/EEA country with based leadership would just make any tariffs levied against the rest of the EU/EEA effectively pointless because companies can just open shell companies with the sole purpose of doing the paperwork to look like goods are coming from the exempt country(much like how Russia exported their shit through China and India to get around sanctions, but this time Hungary can't charge a premium for the privillege because they can't impose tariffs against other EU members).
That doesn't make sense. Neither Porsche nor Mercedes control the tariffs set by the countries they are operating in. They can control their pricing and they can control the location of their production. They could lobby various governments for lower tariffs, but hoping someone listens to you is not a business strategy.
That excerpt is about how individual manufacturers can react, not countries.
hoping someone listens to you is not a business strategy.
Did they even ask? I know, I know, urinalists didn't bother investigating. But such large companies, that contribute much to their countries, surely can do more than just hope.
It wouldn't surprise me if those conversations did take place, but TDS prevailed so they're going to be steadfast.
Changes in price are economic signals. If Europeans aren't filling their parliaments with literal Downs Syndrome politicians yet then they'll be able to recognize the problem and start addressing it.
meanwhile, Toyota has announced they will not be changing prices and will still do business with US. It probably helps that the Corolla is already built in the United States.
There's some serious cope going on in the MAGA movement. While I don't inherently disagree with tariffs, ramping them up right now will hit the working class really hard. Tariffs won't just raise prices on goods being imported. They'll raise prices on everything. It's basic economics 101. What happens when you restrict the supply? Prices go up. Even if one or two companies get their goods restricted because of increased tariffs, but 2 others don't, all of the companies will raise their prices. This is the end result of what happens with capitalism, when companies pursue profits above all other interests. These companies do not give one shit about us, or the welfare of the people, or this nation. It's profit and money (mammonism). That's it.
But, these very simple facts are being ignored by Trump supporters, because it makes Trump look bad. Like I said, I agree with the sentiment, but not right now. Americans are already close to destitution just from buying food, because of the rampant inflation. We have zero wiggle room. Increasing prices now will hurt a lot of people. This should be done later, when companies move their manufacturing back here, and when the economy is better.
But then again, high prices and inflation is caused by central banks, usury, money printing, and fractional reserve lending, essentially where the banks just print infinity fake money. If that isn't stopped, it doesn't matter what Trump, or anyone else, does with tariffs. Devaluation of currency via conjuration of infinity fake money always leads to collapse. Any type of "solution" proposed and enacted on top of malicious banking practices is like trying to build your house upon the sand. It's a fool's errand and doomed to failure.
This should be done later, when companies move their manufacturing back here, and when the economy is better.
Dude, companies aren't going to move manufacturing here without tariffs. It just won't happen.
What happens when you restrict the supply? Prices go up.
So do wages and domestic employment. On the flipside, if you have free for all outsourcing and mass immigration, prices go down. We've lived for 30 years under the low price regime and it's time to stop.
You didn't address the elephant in the room, the biggest point I made: banking.
Dude, companies aren't going to move manufacturing here without tariffs. It just won't happen.
We could, you know, dictate that American companies manufacture in America, or non-American companies which wish to sell in America do all that they can to manufacture in America. Many companies already do this (like car companies). That's what government is supposed to do, enact solutions beneficial for the people. But, since government is corrupt and hates us, we can't expect that to be done. So, in part, I agree with you, that our options are limited, but I still disagree that doing a tariff war right now will be devastating for most people.
So do wages and domestic employment.
Partially yes, but you're ignoring the fact that our wages began to stagnate (stopped keeping up with inflation) in 1971, when Nixon took us off the last vestiges of the gold standard. Trump's "solution" via tariffs, if he doesn't fix inflation and malicious banking practices, won't solve anything. It'll be a bandaid on a gushing wound.
On the flipside, if you have free for all outsourcing and mass immigration, prices go down. We've lived for 30 years under the low price regime and it's time to stop.
You're viewing the world from a modern lens, not realizing how bad things have gotten, and are falling into the false dichotomy trap, that it's an either/or scenario where both solutions fail. Our ancestors made good money, and products were cheap, not even going back to the 50s, 60s, and 70s. That's why fathers back then could work a blue collar job directly out of high school, and within a few years afford a house, a car, and support a wife and several children, without having to work himself to death. We can have good wages and cheap products. It's not an either/or option. But, like I said, this requires quashing bankers and malicious banking practices, which Trump (nor any other current politician) will do. Granted, it would be incredibly foolish to not also clamp down on feminism and mass foreign migration, but the lion's share of our problems stem from bankers.
You didn't address the elephant in the room, the biggest point I made: banking.
Banking is orthogonal to tariffs. Action in one area doesn't exclude action in another. Also quantitative easing is by far the most obvious contribution to the problems you've mentioned, and Trump's government cuts and tariff revenues are designed to mitigate the circumstances that led to massive QE after 2008.
We could, you know, dictate that American companies manufacture in America, or non-American companies which wish to sell in America do all that they can to manufacture in America.
Command economy thinking is the road to perdition. You can force companies to be financially uncompetitive, sure. The unions forced Hostess to hire workers specifically for unloading bread and workers specifically for pastries. Bankrupt and liquidated in 2012.
Our ancestors made good money, and products were cheap, not even going back to the 50s, 60s, and 70s. That's why fathers back then could work a blue collar job directly out of high school, and within a few years afford a house, a car, and support a wife and several children, without having to work himself to death.
Return to the gold standard would be one of the best things we could do. Regardless, there's no reason to hold back on any other good initiatives.
Banking is orthogonal to tariffs. Action in one area doesn't exclude action in another. Also quantitative easing is by far the most obvious contribution to the problems you've mentioned, and Trump's government cuts and tariff revenues are designed to mitigate the circumstances that led to massive QE after 2008.
This is true, but just because they can be tackled independently, does not make them equal issues. I'm talking about the systemic rape of our economic wealth, value of our currency, and national prosperity by malicious bankers and banking practices. As I was trying to point out, trying to improve the economy by hiking tariffs, while completely ignoring the bankers is like trying to put a bandaid on a gushing wound. It won't work. When problems have multiple causes, you address the most egregious first, and work your way down. Trying to get into a tariff war with the entire planet, right now, won't achieve anything other than causing the prices of everything to go up, at a time when people are already struggling to eat and pay their bills.
Also, "quantitative easing" is just money printing. It's one of those malicious banking practices that causes inflation, where they just conjure infinity fake money out of thin air, to fund all their pet projects. It's how BlackRock and Vanguard got all of their start up capital. It's how all the Kalergi plan NGOs get funded. It's how all of our politicians get bought and paid for. It all derives from banking and bankers.
Command economy thinking is the road to perdition. You can force companies to be financially uncompetitive, sure. The unions forced Hostess to hire workers specifically for unloading bread and workers specifically for pastries. Bankrupt and liquidated in 2012.
Are you an anarchist or extreme libertarian? This is precisely what governments are supposed to do, to enact the will of the people, and serve the people's best interests, even by limiting and infringing upon the unlimited scope of businesses, to protect people. This is why our government used to bust monopolies and trusts, to punish insider trading, manipulation of markets, corporate lobbying and preferential treatment, doing away with slave labor and abhorrent corporate treatment of workers. All of those things necessarily resulted in prices going up, but they were for the betterment of the people, because concentration of power in the hands of corporations is just as antagonistic and deadly as it is in the hands of government. People used to understand this nuance.
Hell, the very concept of collectivization (group up) necessarily means that the collective good sometimes outweighs the rights and benefits of the individual, or smaller groups within that structure (i.e. a business). This is why normie right wingers are so obtuse when it comes to proper set up and enactment of governments, nations, communities, and all other groups, because they keep trying to insert individualism as a highest moral virtue, with no other considerations or priorities. Because of the false dichotomy brainwashing surrounding collectivism and individualism, right wingers are trying to make arguments and propose solutions from an incomplete foundation, resulting in all manner of failures.
You can't have a group function, any group, without some form of loss of liberties of the individual. To group up, necessarily requires individual sacrifice for that group, in order for that group to function, be healthy, withstand invaders, prevent corruption, and continue to exist.
There is, of course, a happy medium, where the health of the individual and collective are both weighed and considered, where both prosper. You probably weren't intending it, but your position (at least with how you worded it), would necessarily require the complete sacrifice of the collective for the benefit of the individual (or the corporations), which is odd, considering that companies are also collectives. It's just that you (according to how you're arguing this topic) would rather corporations have unlimited free reign to do whatever they want, and that any infringement upon that freedom by government is somehow evil and wrong.
If you think people in charge of corporations can't be evil, but people in charge of governments can, if you think concentration of power is only deadly when its in the government, but not in corporations, you're extremely naive. I can attest to the evils of corporatism just in my own work life, where companies treat their workers as little more than slaves, and if it weren't illegal for them to do so, they would be more than happy to pay their workers as little as possible, while working them to death. There's an endless list of examples people can give for how companies have fucked them over Why else do you think so many big corporations lobby government to open borders and mass immigrate cheap foreign labor? It's to depress wages so the higher ups can make even more money. Why else would pharmaceutical companies be making trillions off the backs of poisoning their customers? Why else would companies push DEI policies even if it undermines their products? Why else would companies support feminism? Why else would military-industrial complex corporations lobby our governments to pursue more wars, if just to spend more munitions and make more sales of weapons? Why else would farmers mass spray their crops with chemicals that are known to harm human health, if only because it makes their job of farming and harvesting a little easier? Why else has the wealth disparity between CEOs and the average worker gotten so high?
These evils can be largely, if entirely, laid at the feet of corporatism and greed. Government, if its acting properly, is supposed to curb and stop this.
Return to the gold standard would be one of the best things we could do. Regardless, there's no reason to hold back on any other good initiatives.
Well, I agree. We can do more than one thing at once. But, as I've been saying, trying to enact a tariff war with the entire planet, right now, is a bad decision. If we really wanted to solve this issue, we would force these companies to bring their manufacturing back here, close our borders, stop all mass migration, deport all the nons, get women out of the workforce, imprison and execute all bankers, base our currency around a set object or defined labor, and make usury, fractional reserve lending and banking, and all keynesian economics illegal, and put money printing back in the hands of the people. I mean, in the grand scale of it, tariffs aren't even that important. It's a sideways measure to achieve something our government should be doing with companies already.
Many of the problems we're seeing today are from the undue influence bankers have over our nations, governments, and richest people. Through infinite conjuration of fake money, they fund everything that's hurting us. If the problem of banking isn't solved, it doesn't matter what else we do, as it will only be a temporary fix, and we'll still head toward currency devaluation, hyper inflation, and systemic economic and national collapse.
This is all speculative, though, since both the corporations and our governments are corrupt, and absolutely nothing will be done to stop the true causes of our problems.
Mentioning, not doing. It was a carrot waved in front of people's faces to hype a story, similar to releasing the Epstein files, or draining the swamp, or locking up Hillary.
They'll raise prices on everything. It's basic economics 101. ... Even if one or two companies get their goods restricted because of increased tariffs, but 2 others don't, all of the companies will raise their prices.
The companies not tariffed will raise prices initially while they increase production to replace tariffed now-too-expensive goods then price war with each other to lower prices.
In the short run, higher prices and more jobs, in the long run prices return to near prior levels except made in America with new, modern equipment.
The companies not tariffed will raise prices initially while they increase production to replace tariffed now-too-expensive goods then price war with each other to lower prices.
Are you not familiar with the monopolies and trusts going on in several economic sectors, which are no longer being punished by our government, because the politicians are "lobbied" by those sectors? There's some "competition" in a small way, but overall prices always, always go up. That was my main point, because this inflation is being caused by bankers. You guys are trying to tackle a massive problem by going after the branches, not the roots.
In the short run, higher prices and more jobs,
Are you unaware how long it takes a large company to shift manufacturing? This has been decades in the making, ever since NAFTA and globalism took root hard in the 90s under Clinton. Factories cost millions of dollars just to build, sometimes upwards of a billion, and take years to make. Trump's "solution" won't be solved in his term. While that doesn't necessarily make it wrong, it will absolutely just cause prices to inflate further for the next 4 years, and if any milquetoast right winger or Democrat gets into office next, it'll all be undone, and the suffering was for nothing, like how most of politics is. Until those factories are built, there won't be "more jobs". It'll just be higher prices.
in the long run prices return to near prior levels except made in America with new, modern equipment.
Prices will never, ever go down if malicious banking practices aren't stopped/solved. The U.S. dollar has lost over 99% of its value since the implementation of the Federal Reserve in 1913, and wages haven't kept up with inflation since Nixon took us off the last vestiges of the gold standard in 1971.
Are you not familiar with the monopolies and trusts going on in several economic sectors ... You guys are trying to tackle a massive problem by going after the branches, not the roots.
How much of the economy are monopolies that also compete with other countries? Hardly any of it. A monopoly that could raise prices due to tariffs could raise prices anyway because they're already being protected from foreign competition, for instance by the military having to buy domestic components.
Are you unaware how long it takes a large company to shift manufacturing?
A high-tech semiconductor fab only takes a few years here, even with our red tape, and lots of manufacturing requires much less time to set up. The Chinese can do it in weeks; we can too if we want to.
Prices will never, ever go down if malicious banking practices aren't stopped/solved.
That's a completely different issue and obviously I was talking about adjusted dollars.
How much of the economy are monopolies that also compete with other countries? Hardly any of it. A monopoly that could raise prices due to tariffs could raise prices anyway because they're already being protected from foreign competition, for instance by the military having to buy domestic components.
I don't think you're fully grasping the scope of corruption we're facing, and that corruption pervades the corporate sphere just as much as the governmental sphere. It's corporations that lobby government to open borders, mass migrate cheap foreign labor, push women into the workforce, and outsource jobs to cheap foreign markets. The government and economic oligarchs are all in bed with each other. There are smaller domestic companies that have to compete with these mega corps that do all of this globalist bullshit, yes, but most corporations, regardless of size, would still gladly accept cheaper labor, and many tacitly defend it.
These companies aren't "competing" with each other across the globe. They're the ones that argued for that globalization and enacted it. They're the ones that outsourced and imported foreigners. They're not "competing" with themselves here, they're the ones benefiting off of globalism, and all large corporations do this. That's part of the trust, that they all do the same things for the same reasons, manipulating markets and screwing people over so the CEOs can make even more money.
A high-tech semiconductor fab only takes a few years here, even with our red tape, and lots of manufacturing requires much less time to set up. The Chinese can do it in weeks; we can too if we want to.
Years. Thank you. Years. Trump will be out of office before manufacturing comes back. So, all we're left with is higher prices on an already shit economy.
That's a completely different issue and obviously I was talking about adjusted dollars.
It's the primary issue. It's the central, foundational, core issue that needs to be fixed, if anything else is to be fixed. The prioritization of money and profits, above all other considerations, is the heart of the issue. This is why modern banks are so evil, why usury used to be forbidden in the Christian West, why we have so much inflation, why people can barely afford to eat now, whereas fathers used to support their entire family on a single income, why people can't afford to buy a house or retire, why corporations death spiral in "competition" chasing more and more miniscule pennies, why corporations lobby for our own ethnic replacement, because the foreigners are cheaper, why corporations use cheaper and cheaper ingredients and still sell as high as possible, why corporations build obsolescence into their products to design it to fail, turning us into perpetual consumers,......
All of this is downstream of banking and bankers, the very people that, through usury, money printing, and conjuration of money out of thin air, gain so much power over us, as they can buy our politicians and leaders, lording over entire economic sectors, subvert and corrupt entire nations, and even enact wars, all for their benefit.
Trying to improve the economy via a tariff war without fixing banking will not work.
I don't think you're fully grasping the scope of corruption we're facing,
You didn't answer the question, just vague 'it's all globalism all the way down'. Ok, whatever. That's meaningless.
Years. Thank you. Years. Trump will be out of office before manufacturing comes back.
It takes years for the most complicated tech manufacturing that need a clean room and operate on like angstrom scale. Cars maybe a year (but cars are already made here). Other stuff six months, easily doable in less.
You didn't answer the question, just vague 'it's all globalism all the way down'. Ok, whatever. That's meaningless.
I did answer your question, just not the way you wanted. The corporate sphere is just as corrupt as the governmental sphere, and we know governments are insanely corrupt. Governments and corporations are working together to enrich each other. If you'd like a specific answer to
How much of the economy are monopolies that also compete with other countries?
Quite a few corporate monopolies, that operate in the U.S., still compete with foreign nations. People make the mistake that our enemies are monolithic and all powerful. They're not. They hold every anti-virtue imaginable, and inherent to their anti-virtues, can't maintain hegemony and group cohesion with their malicious corrupt buddies. They all have disparate interests, spheres of control, and slightly different goals. One monopoly which operates in the U.S. is competing against the monopoly that exists in China, or India. The governmental subsidized large scale farmers in the U.S. are competing against farmers in other countries. Pharmaceutical mega corps, while competing against each other, have a monopoly on how medicine and the medical industry operate in the U.S., but compete with foreign nations in how they operate their medical industries, especially with those countries that have centralized health care, which impugns on the pharma corps' ability to make as much profits overseas.
It takes years for the most complicated tech manufacturing that need a clean room and operate on like angstrom scale. Cars maybe a year (but cars are already made here). Other stuff six months, easily doable in less.
Have you worked in a factory? I have. It takes a lot more time to get a factory operational than just building it. You have to hire and train all the staff. You have to get all the machines up and running. You have to get the factory running efficiently, with 100% uptime, and troubleshoot lots and lots of problems. You have to increase quality control. All that stuff takes time. The factory I worked at, which at the time was still trying to troubleshoot problems, improve quality control, and get to 100% uptime, ran out of money before achieving that. Most smaller businesses (sub 1000 employees) can't absorb or invest the massive cost of just moving factories and manufacturing.
And, you're forgetting the time it takes before a factory is even built, for companies to shift locations, which itself requires the company to reevaluate, weigh options, run studies, look into possible locations for new factories, get governmental approval and licensing, have engineers design the factory, buy or make the machinery that'll be used to run it, which may also take engineers to design and other smaller factories to create the machinery for, and jump through lots of red tape. It's a lot longer than just 1 year for a standard factory. It takes years.
The shift of manufacturing away from the U.S. took decades. It's not going to be reversed in Trump's term. Anyone claiming otherwise is extremely deluded.
It's maddening how so many people, even on the right, people who claim to be smart in terms of economics, refuse to see the plain truth in front of them, that most of our economic problems are caused by bankers. These concepts aren't even difficult to grasp, either. They're simple.
From the military build up at our air bases, the movement of specific bombers and materiel, and Trump's and Israel's rhetoric lately, it sounds like we're going to get exactly that, by starting a war against Iran.
If tariffs are raising prices, and that's driving away customers, isn't the solution to LOWER prices to "cancel" the price hike?
Very overly simplistic, though.
And not sure what car company profit margins are, but I know some companies run on very tiny ones. If tariffs drive your costs up, and you lower prices...it's impossible to profit.
Also, for a niche market like Porsche especially, making your luxury car a couple thousand dollars cheaper aren't going to attract new customers. And you might still be losing money even if you did, if combined operating costs are higher than sale prices.
The main scenario where lowering prices raises your profits is when you're in a tight and competitive market. Luxury cars, I'm guessing, aren't that; it's a small market to begin with, and lots of people already have their chosen brand...they might not want a Mercedes, if they can get a Porsche, or vice versa. The point over lowering prices is to outcompete, and to expand your customer base. I don't see either of those things happening to a significant degree in this scenario.
As someone else said, the answer is to dodge tariffs completely by opening a US plant.
I think you might be missing the forest for the trees with this, as this article suggests that the tariffs might be an ideological test too.
If a company has competent leadership, they'll just begin looking at an American property to base out of to escape tariffs.
If they are ideologically captured and need to scream how they hate the far right and want to kill Trump, they'll raise prices lowering their sales and slowly lose business to more competitive, probably US based companies, depending on product.
That's political rhetoric. Mercedes is already building some cars here in S. Carolina. However, you can't just build a factory and move production overnight. Trump also only has four years, so what's really the goal here? Everything points to Trump using the tariffs as a negotiating tool to get something else from the E.U., but he needs to make it quick. Americans don't like American cars, so these tariffs are also hurting all the Americans employed to sell and service foreign cars.
Trump should also exempt countries like Hungary from the tariffs. Orbán is Trump's BIGGEST supporter in Europe, and he's taken shit for it too. Mercedes and Audi build lots of cars there and it's a big part of Orbáns economy. Once again, Trump hurts those who support him most. These tariffs really are indiscriminate fire and don't show any sign that Trump and Co. know what they're really doing.
Trump's a businessman. Show you're investing money, show you have legitimate plans to start US production, and you'll likely dodge the tariffs. And get a publicity bump as Trump tells everyone how great and patriotic you are. Which may or may not be a good thing, depending on your customers' average political leanings, I suppose.
Brands like Mercedes, VW/ Audi, BMW, Toyota, Hyundia, etc. ALREADY build at around half their models in N. America. What more is there to do? There are more American-built parts in the Toyota Tundra than the F150 or Silverado. There tariffs are indiscriminate and irresponsible. Nobody sees the "endgame" here and Trump won't say either. It's only been three months and I'm already beyond disappointed with this old man impersonating Trump '16.
Correct. I'm not sure about Mercedes and Porsche but, if true, I agree it could be handled better.
Considering the posturing of Germany and much of the rest of Europe, I'm also not going to cry about it, though. They'll probably talk big and refuse to make concessions, which will further embolden groups like the AfD, I'd imagine.
Uh, he's said it repeatedly. Equalizing tariffs, and bringing back more manufacturing and investment to the US. And it's working, so far. Many companies, including Toyota as you mentioned, are increasing production in the US.
Yes, prices will go up in the short term, but it's encouraging more money to be kept and focused domestically, and I think that's a good thing. It is America first, and it is helping escape from globalism.
It also helps solidify friend/enemy distinction when retard countries like Canada and Germany can't get out of their own way and keep attacking the US while wanting stuff from us.
I'm disappointed and worried about quite a few things...and ecstatic about others. Trump 24 overperformed on many issues, and it's amazing. Shame about the current war posturing, and the massive percentage of not just Zionists, but ulta-Zionists in his cabinet, though.
Trump isn't failing though. He's carrying on the status quo in some arenas (unfortunately), doing really good work in others, and doing bad things in others as well. It's a mixed bag, but overall better than our other options, or other recent presidents.
If they are already being built here then they have absolutely nothing to worry about, as tariffs won't apply to them.
Then what is the problem and why are you crying about it?
The only reason there are any foreign car assembly plants in the USA is Reagan’s import tariffs.
Where are the parts to make the car built? It's not about where you 'assemble' the cars but where the parts for the car are actually made.
Are all the parts made in the USA? I doubt it. They get parts made overseas then assemble them in America and claim "it's built in America" when actually the car was built in pieces somewhere else and ASSEMBLED in America. There's no manufacturing in America to make all those parts. But there will be.
Toyota makes their engines in Texas and their transmissions in another State. Ford/ GM make theirs in Canada.
Like I said, Toyota is more American than Ford. It's why they qualify to compete in NASCAR.
List out all the parts and where they source every material to "make" that engine. Include all the other cars you listed.
There isn't ANY car that's made 100% in any one country. Not even China, which needs to import things like chips for the infotainment and sensors. You're just being a jackass, like 98% of the other comments here.
Japan has been hit by tarrifs, though I'm betting not for long. There will be back and forth negotiations as these are reciprocal tariffs so applying the rates they apply to the US back at them.
If the first move they can think of is raise prices, chances are THEY aren't open to negotiations so screw them.
Exempting Hungary or any other EU/EEA country with based leadership would just make any tariffs levied against the rest of the EU/EEA effectively pointless because companies can just open shell companies with the sole purpose of doing the paperwork to look like goods are coming from the exempt country(much like how Russia exported their shit through China and India to get around sanctions, but this time Hungary can't charge a premium for the privillege because they can't impose tariffs against other EU members).
I like how the thought of lowering tariffs against the US to get a reciprocal lowering of tariffs from the US doesn't even cross their mind.
Everything is on the table, except not fucking the US.
That doesn't make sense. Neither Porsche nor Mercedes control the tariffs set by the countries they are operating in. They can control their pricing and they can control the location of their production. They could lobby various governments for lower tariffs, but hoping someone listens to you is not a business strategy.
That excerpt is about how individual manufacturers can react, not countries.
Did they even ask? I know, I know, urinalists didn't bother investigating. But such large companies, that contribute much to their countries, surely can do more than just hope.
It wouldn't surprise me if those conversations did take place, but TDS prevailed so they're going to be steadfast.
Changes in price are economic signals. If Europeans aren't filling their parliaments with literal Downs Syndrome politicians yet then they'll be able to recognize the problem and start addressing it.
meanwhile, Toyota has announced they will not be changing prices and will still do business with US. It probably helps that the Corolla is already built in the United States.
Those brands are luxury and status products. They can raise prices and people with more money than sense will still buy them.
There's some serious cope going on in the MAGA movement. While I don't inherently disagree with tariffs, ramping them up right now will hit the working class really hard. Tariffs won't just raise prices on goods being imported. They'll raise prices on everything. It's basic economics 101. What happens when you restrict the supply? Prices go up. Even if one or two companies get their goods restricted because of increased tariffs, but 2 others don't, all of the companies will raise their prices. This is the end result of what happens with capitalism, when companies pursue profits above all other interests. These companies do not give one shit about us, or the welfare of the people, or this nation. It's profit and money (mammonism). That's it.
But, these very simple facts are being ignored by Trump supporters, because it makes Trump look bad. Like I said, I agree with the sentiment, but not right now. Americans are already close to destitution just from buying food, because of the rampant inflation. We have zero wiggle room. Increasing prices now will hurt a lot of people. This should be done later, when companies move their manufacturing back here, and when the economy is better.
But then again, high prices and inflation is caused by central banks, usury, money printing, and fractional reserve lending, essentially where the banks just print infinity fake money. If that isn't stopped, it doesn't matter what Trump, or anyone else, does with tariffs. Devaluation of currency via conjuration of infinity fake money always leads to collapse. Any type of "solution" proposed and enacted on top of malicious banking practices is like trying to build your house upon the sand. It's a fool's errand and doomed to failure.
Dude, companies aren't going to move manufacturing here without tariffs. It just won't happen.
So do wages and domestic employment. On the flipside, if you have free for all outsourcing and mass immigration, prices go down. We've lived for 30 years under the low price regime and it's time to stop.
You didn't address the elephant in the room, the biggest point I made: banking.
We could, you know, dictate that American companies manufacture in America, or non-American companies which wish to sell in America do all that they can to manufacture in America. Many companies already do this (like car companies). That's what government is supposed to do, enact solutions beneficial for the people. But, since government is corrupt and hates us, we can't expect that to be done. So, in part, I agree with you, that our options are limited, but I still disagree that doing a tariff war right now will be devastating for most people.
Partially yes, but you're ignoring the fact that our wages began to stagnate (stopped keeping up with inflation) in 1971, when Nixon took us off the last vestiges of the gold standard. Trump's "solution" via tariffs, if he doesn't fix inflation and malicious banking practices, won't solve anything. It'll be a bandaid on a gushing wound.
You're viewing the world from a modern lens, not realizing how bad things have gotten, and are falling into the false dichotomy trap, that it's an either/or scenario where both solutions fail. Our ancestors made good money, and products were cheap, not even going back to the 50s, 60s, and 70s. That's why fathers back then could work a blue collar job directly out of high school, and within a few years afford a house, a car, and support a wife and several children, without having to work himself to death. We can have good wages and cheap products. It's not an either/or option. But, like I said, this requires quashing bankers and malicious banking practices, which Trump (nor any other current politician) will do. Granted, it would be incredibly foolish to not also clamp down on feminism and mass foreign migration, but the lion's share of our problems stem from bankers.
Banking is orthogonal to tariffs. Action in one area doesn't exclude action in another. Also quantitative easing is by far the most obvious contribution to the problems you've mentioned, and Trump's government cuts and tariff revenues are designed to mitigate the circumstances that led to massive QE after 2008.
Command economy thinking is the road to perdition. You can force companies to be financially uncompetitive, sure. The unions forced Hostess to hire workers specifically for unloading bread and workers specifically for pastries. Bankrupt and liquidated in 2012.
Return to the gold standard would be one of the best things we could do. Regardless, there's no reason to hold back on any other good initiatives.
This is true, but just because they can be tackled independently, does not make them equal issues. I'm talking about the systemic rape of our economic wealth, value of our currency, and national prosperity by malicious bankers and banking practices. As I was trying to point out, trying to improve the economy by hiking tariffs, while completely ignoring the bankers is like trying to put a bandaid on a gushing wound. It won't work. When problems have multiple causes, you address the most egregious first, and work your way down. Trying to get into a tariff war with the entire planet, right now, won't achieve anything other than causing the prices of everything to go up, at a time when people are already struggling to eat and pay their bills.
Also, "quantitative easing" is just money printing. It's one of those malicious banking practices that causes inflation, where they just conjure infinity fake money out of thin air, to fund all their pet projects. It's how BlackRock and Vanguard got all of their start up capital. It's how all the Kalergi plan NGOs get funded. It's how all of our politicians get bought and paid for. It all derives from banking and bankers.
Are you an anarchist or extreme libertarian? This is precisely what governments are supposed to do, to enact the will of the people, and serve the people's best interests, even by limiting and infringing upon the unlimited scope of businesses, to protect people. This is why our government used to bust monopolies and trusts, to punish insider trading, manipulation of markets, corporate lobbying and preferential treatment, doing away with slave labor and abhorrent corporate treatment of workers. All of those things necessarily resulted in prices going up, but they were for the betterment of the people, because concentration of power in the hands of corporations is just as antagonistic and deadly as it is in the hands of government. People used to understand this nuance.
Hell, the very concept of collectivization (group up) necessarily means that the collective good sometimes outweighs the rights and benefits of the individual, or smaller groups within that structure (i.e. a business). This is why normie right wingers are so obtuse when it comes to proper set up and enactment of governments, nations, communities, and all other groups, because they keep trying to insert individualism as a highest moral virtue, with no other considerations or priorities. Because of the false dichotomy brainwashing surrounding collectivism and individualism, right wingers are trying to make arguments and propose solutions from an incomplete foundation, resulting in all manner of failures.
You can't have a group function, any group, without some form of loss of liberties of the individual. To group up, necessarily requires individual sacrifice for that group, in order for that group to function, be healthy, withstand invaders, prevent corruption, and continue to exist.
There is, of course, a happy medium, where the health of the individual and collective are both weighed and considered, where both prosper. You probably weren't intending it, but your position (at least with how you worded it), would necessarily require the complete sacrifice of the collective for the benefit of the individual (or the corporations), which is odd, considering that companies are also collectives. It's just that you (according to how you're arguing this topic) would rather corporations have unlimited free reign to do whatever they want, and that any infringement upon that freedom by government is somehow evil and wrong.
If you think people in charge of corporations can't be evil, but people in charge of governments can, if you think concentration of power is only deadly when its in the government, but not in corporations, you're extremely naive. I can attest to the evils of corporatism just in my own work life, where companies treat their workers as little more than slaves, and if it weren't illegal for them to do so, they would be more than happy to pay their workers as little as possible, while working them to death. There's an endless list of examples people can give for how companies have fucked them over Why else do you think so many big corporations lobby government to open borders and mass immigrate cheap foreign labor? It's to depress wages so the higher ups can make even more money. Why else would pharmaceutical companies be making trillions off the backs of poisoning their customers? Why else would companies push DEI policies even if it undermines their products? Why else would companies support feminism? Why else would military-industrial complex corporations lobby our governments to pursue more wars, if just to spend more munitions and make more sales of weapons? Why else would farmers mass spray their crops with chemicals that are known to harm human health, if only because it makes their job of farming and harvesting a little easier? Why else has the wealth disparity between CEOs and the average worker gotten so high?
These evils can be largely, if entirely, laid at the feet of corporatism and greed. Government, if its acting properly, is supposed to curb and stop this.
Well, I agree. We can do more than one thing at once. But, as I've been saying, trying to enact a tariff war with the entire planet, right now, is a bad decision. If we really wanted to solve this issue, we would force these companies to bring their manufacturing back here, close our borders, stop all mass migration, deport all the nons, get women out of the workforce, imprison and execute all bankers, base our currency around a set object or defined labor, and make usury, fractional reserve lending and banking, and all keynesian economics illegal, and put money printing back in the hands of the people. I mean, in the grand scale of it, tariffs aren't even that important. It's a sideways measure to achieve something our government should be doing with companies already.
Many of the problems we're seeing today are from the undue influence bankers have over our nations, governments, and richest people. Through infinite conjuration of fake money, they fund everything that's hurting us. If the problem of banking isn't solved, it doesn't matter what else we do, as it will only be a temporary fix, and we'll still head toward currency devaluation, hyper inflation, and systemic economic and national collapse.
This is all speculative, though, since both the corporations and our governments are corrupt, and absolutely nothing will be done to stop the true causes of our problems.
Why do you think there have been mentions of auditing fort knox?
Mentioning, not doing. It was a carrot waved in front of people's faces to hype a story, similar to releasing the Epstein files, or draining the swamp, or locking up Hillary.
The companies not tariffed will raise prices initially while they increase production to replace tariffed now-too-expensive goods then price war with each other to lower prices.
In the short run, higher prices and more jobs, in the long run prices return to near prior levels except made in America with new, modern equipment.
Are you not familiar with the monopolies and trusts going on in several economic sectors, which are no longer being punished by our government, because the politicians are "lobbied" by those sectors? There's some "competition" in a small way, but overall prices always, always go up. That was my main point, because this inflation is being caused by bankers. You guys are trying to tackle a massive problem by going after the branches, not the roots.
Are you unaware how long it takes a large company to shift manufacturing? This has been decades in the making, ever since NAFTA and globalism took root hard in the 90s under Clinton. Factories cost millions of dollars just to build, sometimes upwards of a billion, and take years to make. Trump's "solution" won't be solved in his term. While that doesn't necessarily make it wrong, it will absolutely just cause prices to inflate further for the next 4 years, and if any milquetoast right winger or Democrat gets into office next, it'll all be undone, and the suffering was for nothing, like how most of politics is. Until those factories are built, there won't be "more jobs". It'll just be higher prices.
Prices will never, ever go down if malicious banking practices aren't stopped/solved. The U.S. dollar has lost over 99% of its value since the implementation of the Federal Reserve in 1913, and wages haven't kept up with inflation since Nixon took us off the last vestiges of the gold standard in 1971.
How much of the economy are monopolies that also compete with other countries? Hardly any of it. A monopoly that could raise prices due to tariffs could raise prices anyway because they're already being protected from foreign competition, for instance by the military having to buy domestic components.
A high-tech semiconductor fab only takes a few years here, even with our red tape, and lots of manufacturing requires much less time to set up. The Chinese can do it in weeks; we can too if we want to.
That's a completely different issue and obviously I was talking about adjusted dollars.
I don't think you're fully grasping the scope of corruption we're facing, and that corruption pervades the corporate sphere just as much as the governmental sphere. It's corporations that lobby government to open borders, mass migrate cheap foreign labor, push women into the workforce, and outsource jobs to cheap foreign markets. The government and economic oligarchs are all in bed with each other. There are smaller domestic companies that have to compete with these mega corps that do all of this globalist bullshit, yes, but most corporations, regardless of size, would still gladly accept cheaper labor, and many tacitly defend it.
These companies aren't "competing" with each other across the globe. They're the ones that argued for that globalization and enacted it. They're the ones that outsourced and imported foreigners. They're not "competing" with themselves here, they're the ones benefiting off of globalism, and all large corporations do this. That's part of the trust, that they all do the same things for the same reasons, manipulating markets and screwing people over so the CEOs can make even more money.
Years. Thank you. Years. Trump will be out of office before manufacturing comes back. So, all we're left with is higher prices on an already shit economy.
It's the primary issue. It's the central, foundational, core issue that needs to be fixed, if anything else is to be fixed. The prioritization of money and profits, above all other considerations, is the heart of the issue. This is why modern banks are so evil, why usury used to be forbidden in the Christian West, why we have so much inflation, why people can barely afford to eat now, whereas fathers used to support their entire family on a single income, why people can't afford to buy a house or retire, why corporations death spiral in "competition" chasing more and more miniscule pennies, why corporations lobby for our own ethnic replacement, because the foreigners are cheaper, why corporations use cheaper and cheaper ingredients and still sell as high as possible, why corporations build obsolescence into their products to design it to fail, turning us into perpetual consumers,......
All of this is downstream of banking and bankers, the very people that, through usury, money printing, and conjuration of money out of thin air, gain so much power over us, as they can buy our politicians and leaders, lording over entire economic sectors, subvert and corrupt entire nations, and even enact wars, all for their benefit.
Trying to improve the economy via a tariff war without fixing banking will not work.
You didn't answer the question, just vague 'it's all globalism all the way down'. Ok, whatever. That's meaningless.
It takes years for the most complicated tech manufacturing that need a clean room and operate on like angstrom scale. Cars maybe a year (but cars are already made here). Other stuff six months, easily doable in less.
I did answer your question, just not the way you wanted. The corporate sphere is just as corrupt as the governmental sphere, and we know governments are insanely corrupt. Governments and corporations are working together to enrich each other. If you'd like a specific answer to
Quite a few corporate monopolies, that operate in the U.S., still compete with foreign nations. People make the mistake that our enemies are monolithic and all powerful. They're not. They hold every anti-virtue imaginable, and inherent to their anti-virtues, can't maintain hegemony and group cohesion with their malicious corrupt buddies. They all have disparate interests, spheres of control, and slightly different goals. One monopoly which operates in the U.S. is competing against the monopoly that exists in China, or India. The governmental subsidized large scale farmers in the U.S. are competing against farmers in other countries. Pharmaceutical mega corps, while competing against each other, have a monopoly on how medicine and the medical industry operate in the U.S., but compete with foreign nations in how they operate their medical industries, especially with those countries that have centralized health care, which impugns on the pharma corps' ability to make as much profits overseas.
Have you worked in a factory? I have. It takes a lot more time to get a factory operational than just building it. You have to hire and train all the staff. You have to get all the machines up and running. You have to get the factory running efficiently, with 100% uptime, and troubleshoot lots and lots of problems. You have to increase quality control. All that stuff takes time. The factory I worked at, which at the time was still trying to troubleshoot problems, improve quality control, and get to 100% uptime, ran out of money before achieving that. Most smaller businesses (sub 1000 employees) can't absorb or invest the massive cost of just moving factories and manufacturing.
And, you're forgetting the time it takes before a factory is even built, for companies to shift locations, which itself requires the company to reevaluate, weigh options, run studies, look into possible locations for new factories, get governmental approval and licensing, have engineers design the factory, buy or make the machinery that'll be used to run it, which may also take engineers to design and other smaller factories to create the machinery for, and jump through lots of red tape. It's a lot longer than just 1 year for a standard factory. It takes years.
The shift of manufacturing away from the U.S. took decades. It's not going to be reversed in Trump's term. Anyone claiming otherwise is extremely deluded.
As you can see from the replies, they don't want to hear it here either. I'm not making any more excuses for Trump.
It's maddening how so many people, even on the right, people who claim to be smart in terms of economics, refuse to see the plain truth in front of them, that most of our economic problems are caused by bankers. These concepts aren't even difficult to grasp, either. They're simple.
and yet more still refuse to identify those bankers and see just how related trump is to that identification...
Maybe a few will wake up if we start another war on behalf of Israel.
From the military build up at our air bases, the movement of specific bombers and materiel, and Trump's and Israel's rhetoric lately, it sounds like we're going to get exactly that, by starting a war against Iran.
If tariffs are raising prices, and that's driving away customers, isn't the solution to LOWER prices to "cancel" the price hike?
That way prices stay the same, at the cost of lower profit margins, but business stays steady. Right?
Very overly simplistic, though.
And not sure what car company profit margins are, but I know some companies run on very tiny ones. If tariffs drive your costs up, and you lower prices...it's impossible to profit.
Also, for a niche market like Porsche especially, making your luxury car a couple thousand dollars cheaper aren't going to attract new customers. And you might still be losing money even if you did, if combined operating costs are higher than sale prices.
The main scenario where lowering prices raises your profits is when you're in a tight and competitive market. Luxury cars, I'm guessing, aren't that; it's a small market to begin with, and lots of people already have their chosen brand...they might not want a Mercedes, if they can get a Porsche, or vice versa. The point over lowering prices is to outcompete, and to expand your customer base. I don't see either of those things happening to a significant degree in this scenario.
As someone else said, the answer is to dodge tariffs completely by opening a US plant.