A core lie of the democrat party
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I'll go out on a limb and assume you're talking about abortion.
What's the gender of abortion doctors?
Oh, but they're not the murderers. The women are. Wait, are you saying that you want to not only jail women for having abortions, but give them more severe sentences than the doctors?
It's as if you're looking for ways to lose elections.
It's not an either
let's use a less politically charged example to explore this question. If I were to hire somebody to kill my boss (not that I would, but stay with me), am I the murderer, or is the guy who I hired the murderer? the answer is we were both accomplices to the act.
in the case of the abortion, this would mean that both were culpable, which raises the stats in both directions, though disproportionately on one side.
not trying to be a dick here, but I'm a little too autistic not to poke that hole in the logic, lol.
Right. I'm not sure on the exact English terminology, but this is certainly directionally correct.
But normally, anti-abortion advocates say that they only want to go after the doctors. If they start branding the women as murderers, then this implies that they also want to prosecute the women for murder, and this would be a bad idea for them - or at least the politicians who have such an albatross around their neck.
Far from it. You are making a good point. I like it when people make good arguments (not very common), even ones that poke holes in my logic.
I can only speak for myself on this, but here goes.
on the one hand, the moral choice would be to go after the doctors and the women, but as you said, there are pragmatic reasons not to. If the goal is to stop as many abortions as possible while shifting what little public support there is in favor of stopping abortions as little as possible, then it makes sense to target doctors(god i hope that's not too confusing, lol). it's a trade off. =/
yeah, but text-based conversations are prone to misunderstandings, and I tend to overthink things, so here we are, lmao.
Nope, makes perfect sense. Of course, it opens people up to the accusation of hypocrisy, same as leftists when they're OK with a murderer being prosecuted for double murder when a woman is pregnant, thus recognizing the potential life as a child in that context but not others.
Not a bad thing. It's not exactly as if there is a surfeit of pleasant people here.
Millions of women killing their children and thousands of doctors aiding them, huh, it’s like math exists. Hilariously insane argument to say elections are more important than 65 million plus dead babies over 50 years. I get that society is far to gynocentric to even entertain the notion that the mother is culpable, but truth exists and what I said is entirely true.
The doctors are merely 'aiding' them? Now, I'm not an expert on the mechanics, but I'm pretty sure the mothers don't have to do that much.
I mean, this is a "muh climate is more important than the Mona Lisa so let's vandalize it". Even if I wanted to prevent as many abortions as possible, and I don't because many people who shouldn't reproduce would, I wouldn't go about doing it in the most counterproductive way possible.
I agree. If it's murder, which I don't think it is, then the mother is as responsible as the doctor. But of course, you're not going to get very far making that argument, because there is a difference between a fertilized egg and an embryo and a 'child'.
Mothers are the main drivers of the abortion the doctors in this argument literally act as a tool of the whims of the mother. No different than a pistol or abortion pill.
I’ve done this sad debate with you over and over, there isn’t any distinctive human difference between a newborn and a fetus, the only difference is an emotional attachment versus a trained disassociation.
Abortion pills don't have agency. People do. If one believes that it's murder, they're more like hitmen.
Please note that I specified fertilized egg and embryo. I don't believe in late-term abortions, and I do think that that is murder.
"When you're losing an argument, just Gish Gallop away from it and pretend that you've won."
While I'm not anti-abortion (I think it's probably an unavoidable but necessary evil, though I'm pretty convinced at this point that it's far more damaging to women than just having the baby would have been), I am consistently embarrassed when hearing the arguments from the pro-abortion side as they slide goalposts from field to field to rink to court to course as they dodge the morality question.
I can't say I've had that experience, but I do know you're a big fan of mine.
Probably. Having kids changes women for the better. The question is whether we want even more children of single mothers running around and being criminals. I say no.
Funny, I have the same feeling. For example, "IT'S HER OWN BODY". Not really, it is a separate organism. The question is if you believe this is developed enough to deserve rights.
Interesting question. Go find us a stat. Until then, let's assume 50/50. Which, when you include DIY abortions, would still be majority female.
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC6466461/
(retracted because the author was anti-abortion
But let's assume that they're 50/50. DIY abortions would not make 'the overwhelming majority' female, perhaps a very small majority.
In Florida from 2011-2016. Do you even bother reading your own sources? Let’s assume they’re 50/50 and the mother has equal culpability. That would mean millions of guilty mothers (65 million abortions since roe as of 2021) and thousands of guilty doctors. So yes, the massively overwhelming amount of homicide is still female because it’s MILLIONS versus THOUSANDS when you account for all homicide.
OK, so you're doubling down. Execute millions of women then?
You were luckier than I was trying to find numbers. But that's obviously disparate percentages only because Florida discriminates against female physicians. /s
You made the claim women murder more, you find the stats. Btw DV is known to increase abuse during pregnancy, and men kill pregnant women at higher rates.
Not being pregnant by some men saves the woman's life. But, women don't mean anything to you. You don't care about those stats.
Women commit DV at higher stats than men across the board. It would also track that pregnant women are more abusive.
Stupid liar. The search results for cut and lasting YOUR COMMENT proves you know you made it up, because it all proves my statement that men kill pregnant women, and termination doesn't just save the woman's life, they aren't stuck with 18 yrs of more abuse.
https://www.marchofdimes.org/find-support/topics/pregnancy/abuse-during-pregnancy
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC4361157/
https://vawnet.org/material/fact-sheet-domestic-violence-and-pregnancy
https://nationalpartnership.org/report/intimate-partner-violence/
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Domestic_violence_and_pregnancy
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC2442136/
I'm sorry your mom raised a woman hater.
Oh hey, our sometimes-resident feminist retard shows her bigoted, misandrous face again.
No I didn't. Antonio insinuated that abortion doctors are usually men, so I told him to find the stats. Which, to his credit, he tried to do.
It's the same as if you hire a hitman, both the principal and the agent are culpable for the murder.