The majority of liberal academia claim the Greeks were very accepting and approved of homosexuality. Meanwhile a smaller group seems to be fighting against the notion that homosexuality was so overtly practiced and accepted.
One front of this divide seems to be the character of Patroclus in 'The Illiad' A minor character outside of his relationship with Achilles. But at some point more modern scholars have begun to portray them as lovers. I remember mainstream YouTube reviewers criticizing "Troy" for making them cousins as opposed to lovers. There's nothing in his original myths or the Illiad poem that states he's gay. He was raised with Achilles in Achilles' dad's court. There is reference to them being closer than brothers but that doesn't necessarily mean gay.
Do you see Patroclus and by extension Achilles as gay?
Leather apron club did a whole hour long episode about this. Worth watching.
No, the ancient Greeks hated fags.
That video is where I learned they called gays “cistern ass” and I want that to catch on again.
I agree, I have watched it.
I've read a lot of Greek literature.
Not at all.
The whole Greeks are gay, imo, stems from English readers misinterpreting brotherly love and womanly love. Greeks did view the love between brother-at-arms (friends who were like brothers) to be stronger than the love between a man-and-woman. Aristotle even says in his work that a woman cannot love a man as strongly as a man loves a man because a woman never sacrifices for the other and always views the relationship as a transaction with the desired outcome to be such that the relationship benefits her more than the man.
The Greeks were simply right but somewhere down the line the idea of men loving men like brothers (friends) got forgotten and love started to only be attributed to the opposite sex or literal family. Arguably, this was done on purpose from a top-down perspective to weaken male bonds and chain all men to women because the men become easier to control by rulers. The women would have latched onto the same because men with weak bonds to other men are easier for her to control also. One of the areas we still see brotherly love come to fruition in modernity is war. The Greeks were a waring people so they'd have experienced this, especially those in the outskirt towns who weren't from the artsy Athenians. It's no surprise that one of the most notorious modern examples of brotherly love came from Lord of the Rings where the author serves in WWI yet many said Sam and Frodo were gay when they clearly weren't, at all.
Were there Greek philosophers fucking boys? Probably, of course. Every society gets its fair share of gays. To say Greeks as a whole were significantly gay or tolerated gays is false. Most accounts I can recall from primary sources describing gay tendencies were never positive.
The problem is that English has only one word for love and tards keep interpreting it as eros.
The idea that men can't be friends, that there must be some sexual component involved, is so contrary to reality that there is no doubt it is artificial.
Camaraderie is a real thing. Even non combat male friendship, is a real thing.
Sodomites as always lie, warp and distort in an attempt to normalize themselves, because at heart they know that they are freaks and their behavior is unnatural and wrong.
The loudest voices behind all of the shipping of male friendships, from Achilles and Patroclus to Alexander and Hephaestion to Sam and Frodo to Will and Mike in Stranger Things, are not the male homosexuals but lonely, sex-starved young women. Women have always had a deep-seeded insecurity about male friendships, and have never been comfortable with the idea that straight men would ever prefer spending time with each other over spending time with women. They insist on twisting every close male friendship in fiction and history into a homosexual relationship because that's the only thing that makes it acceptable to them, the only way they can quiet their own insecurities.
The Japanese have a good term for those women, fujos, aka "rotten women".
Anyone who says Achilles and Patroclus were gay in the Illiad is just repeating Internet nonsense. Even woke scholars admit homer's wordage for their relationship is not remotely sexual.
The cope among woke scholars is that the sacking of Troy was an oral tale before Homer wrote it down, so thE lOst oRaL TradITiOn cOulD haVe hAd TheM GAY!!!
Well, the Iliad was an oral tale before Homer wrote it down, but they sure as hell weren't "gay" in the oral tale either.
ThEy CoUld hAvE BeEn!!
/s
Unfortunately, I'm not up to spec on Greek literature. I only know Patroclus as the asshole son of Sophitia Alexandra. But now that you bring up his... relation with Achilles, wasn't it said that Achilles crossdressed once, going under the name Pyrrha?
Achilles' mother received a prophecy basically saying he'd either die young in war and be remembered forever or live a long fulfilling life and be forgotten. She wanted him to live a long life so had he (and his best friend/cousin/whatever) Patroclus sent off to live as women with a bunch of priestesses to keep him from being pulled into what would become the Trojan war. The two best buds were living it up with the young ladies when Odysseus figured out where Achilles' mom had hidden them (Patroclus was hiding from a murder rap) and went there with a beautifully made spear, knowing that Achilles wouldn't be able to conceal his desire for the weapon.
Through this ruse Odysseus was easily able to convince Achilles to join the war, and gained the Hellenes their most able warrior.
So yeah, he cross-dressed, kinda, so him and his best bud could live secretly in the girls' dorm and have the time of their lives until duty called him off to kill the enemies of their people.
I am not familiar with that Achilles story.
I googled and found....According to some post Homeric stories (including "The Achilleid" by Statius) Achilles cross dressed to avoid dying in the Trojan War.
No, faggot retards who've never been loved by friends or spouses think anything more than acquaintance fellowship must be secret faggot love. You see this in modern(ish) day with the same fags saying everyone in LoTR is gay because the men embraced or kissed the brow of another.
'Gay' is an anachronism when talking about ancient Greece. Close to no one was 'gay' and those who were, were relentlessly mocked. Insofar as there were homosexual relations, it was bisexual pederasty - men were married to women but also pursued 'beardless boys' (yes, I know it's revolting). Mostly an aristocratic phenomenon, because then as now and at every time, the morals of the rich were quite bad.
In Homer, Achilles and Patroklos were just very good friends. Later on, some portrayed them as lovers, perhaps to justify their own actions. A lot of ancient tales postdate Homer or are different, for example the story of Meleagar, Oidopous and even 'the Judgment of Paris'.