NATO without the USA? Hungarian PM Viktor Orban pitches idea
(www.firstpost.com)
Comments (16)
sorted by:
nato should have disbanded after the soviet union broke apart.
NATO is a perfect example of that old Nietzsche quote on becoming the monster you fight.
There would be no point to NATO without the US. NATO is the means by which every other country in NATO outsources its national defense to the US in exchange for sovereignty.
If the EU countries all spent 3%+ GDP on defense, they would have kicked the US out decades ago. They purposely spend a lot less, 1-1.5%, so they can funnel the rest into welfare spending, and use the US taxpayer to make up the difference. It's a very one-sided arrangement, but the US goes along with it because it's basically a very expensive "pay for influence" scheme that no president has been willing to end. Trump tried to reduce it somewhat.
There would be no need for NATO without the US meddling, either.
It would strengthen the ties between the EU members if NATO membership was the same as EU membership. So there is merit to that if you want greater European integration. It's why the United States is so integrated because of having a common federal military in addition to the 50 state militaries. On the other hand, if you are a Eurosceptic, then Orban's proposal may be not so great. Also, a bunch of NATO countries would have to get the boot, not just the U.S. Turkey and Canada for example.
Yeah but ditching those losers also in it would be cool.
I mean that would be great but post WW2 Europe doesn't have the current production means or personal numbers to do this, let alone the united will to stand up to a 'Russian invasion' without the US
Maybe this was by design to keep Europe dependant on the US for protection therefore more inclined to follow US policies or just because of decades of ineffectual leadership but either way it currently can't start especially with the 'net zero' agenda they are pushing since weapon manufacture and military build up is both energy intensive and labour intensive so you need energy security and food security for you to build up a strong military.
Maybe? Maybe this super obvious and super convenient thing for the US was done, just maybe. We all know what a certain group of European countries did some 80-90 years ago when they were independent of the US and were both capable and incentivized to become powerful forces themselves and dare not depend on the US ever.
This would be like me being unsure if US destabilizing most countries in the middle eastern region and waging war on them for decades while giving Israel billions of dollars annually and full military support maybe indicates there's more to the Israeli-US relationship than meets the eye? Maybe, we'll never know eh?
It's hard to know what is by design and what happens when you put retards in charge because they said nice things before the election day.
Essentially, we have too many voters sitting in the pot as it slowly boils that I can't tell if this is just the result of no one telling them no before..
I'd be all for it as an American, except we'd get drug back into their spats eventually anyway. That and if Russia decided it wanted Europe I'm not sure the EU could prop up enough industrial production to repel an invasion.
It would no longer be NATO then, which I suppose is kind of his point. More like an EU army? I am all for unlinking American and European defense. It doesn't mean we can't go to their aid as allies when attacked.
NATO exists to keep mum, dad, and all the crazy uncles out of world politics.
Orban is just trying to kiss up to Putin, again.
The EU & international media led the charge on Ukraine, and the US just got dragged along as usual to provide most of the money to subsidize euro military priorities, as always.
Yeah, poor ol' USA had nothing to do with this whatsoever, they just got unwillingly dragged into this by those stupid totally independent non globalist European traitors.