Man. Some of the stuff Putin is saying, I can totally understand, and am sort of sympathetic to: the feeling hurt that the Soviet Union sort of "peacefully" collapsed, and went away, and that their leaders did this, thinking Russia was going to get tons of help, not be encroached upon, and even be sort of enthusiastically invited into the fold with open arms? That that's what they felt, and they now feel that's not what happened? That, instead, it's clear that NATO/The West is still treating them as a threat, and expanding towards them? That stuff is sympathetic.
The part where he is saying that the main goal for this war now is "Denazification"? Come on. Get the fuck out of here. There is zero way that Russia is afraid of like - what - a fourth reich forming in the Ukraine? That that's the main reason for the fighting here? Two years of war to stop Nazis, and he's saying that successful denazification is the only condition for ending this?
In any event, it's absolutely ridiculous that this guy - the leader of a big country like Russia - a country that clearly has the potential to cause big problems for the world (they are doing it right now), clearly has all these grievances (whether or not they are legitimate or not), and Tucker fucking Carlson is the guy that has to go there to air all this out. What are our fucking politicians doing? What is the fucking media doing? Why wouldn't they be holding those politicians feet to the fire? Why is it up to basically an independent guy to do all their jobs?
To be fair: Ukraine isn't really doing themselves any favor with how some of the people are. I know a couple Hungarians who are also not the biggest fans of Ukraine specifically because how they treat their Hungarian minority who've lived there for many generations(attempt to poison water supply, general unrest and attacks). Just one angle to look at.
Yeah there are legit nazis that are in Ukraine it's not just leftist style fear mongering, not necessarily a justification of course but if that's the shit you've seen as a Russian I completely understand why that perspective would scare the fuck out of you and you would do everything to keep those people away.
The joke is as well there was a bit of discussion about the media's reaction to this and even a few people in the media sort of questioned it. Okay why the hell are we allowing actual nazis to fight in Ukraine and what's going on? Of course, immediately shut up and toed the party line because word got around to keep quiet about it.
They really are actual Nazis. Israel is just willing to look the other way for their own potential advantage, possibly in securing energy supplies from a nearby country, and one who's government is mostly just the US security state. Doubly so, if they think they can have significant political influence. They probably think they can manage it.
They're dead fucking wrong.
If you're not sure, listen to the Ukranian Nazis talk. Even they know the irony of a jewish state sponsoring them; but they have explicitly stated this is their best chance to basically run the government and build a National Socialist state. And, they're right. They have more legitimacy and popularity in Ukraine than at any time.
Don't forget, Hitler sold weapons and food to Stalin to secure his border, even while ranting about Judeo-Bolshevism, and how big of a threat the Soviet Union was. They even allied. Stalin genuinely didn't believe that Hitler would betray him. This isn't the first time NatSocs have played this game.
That is such a difficult subject for Americans. I talked about Ostis to someone here, and they had no idea there were Germans in places like Poland and the Ukraine. They know there are German villages in the US, but have a hard time believing it can be like that all over.
It's not difficult for me. If Putin, or whoever, wanted to show me evidence that there are Neo-Nazi types - and not just a couple, but huge amounts - in the Ukraine, and that they are causing problems for ethnic Russians, I could believe that.
That's a far crying from saying that the problem is so bad that you need to wage a massive two year war killing hundreds of thousands over Nazis? What sort of power do these Nazis have there? What are they doing to Russia/Russians?
Russia’s “massive two year war” isn’t against Ukraine. Without untold billions in cash and weapons, Ukraine would have folded in three months. Russia is at war with NATO. Ukraine are simply providing the meat for the grinder. And it’s no skin off the Ukrainian government’s back; they’re skimming billions, and they aren’t even Ukrainian.
It's not difficult for me. If Putin, or whoever, wanted to show me evidence that there are Neo-Nazi types in the Ukraine, and that they are causing problems for ethnic Russians, I could believe that.
That's a far crying from saying that the problem is so bad that you need to wage a massive two year war killing hundreds of thousands over Nazis? What sort of power do these Nazis have there? What are they doing to Russia/Russians?
They've been bombing and mortaring and politically suppressing and linguistically suppressing the eastern russian speaking provinces (and the small hungarian enclave in the west aint all too happy with their treatment either) for a long time.
Azov had been at war with them long before Russia officially came in in 2022
If you ignore the fake new official borders drawn up on maps by the west, like in Africa, and think more along actual nation lines, then yeah I do see why some of these fights start, and they had been at war with Russians before 2022. People don't like to be forced together, and when you do it, one oppresses the other. The swiss are 3 different nations who joined together voluntarily. The Ukraine is 3 who have been forced together, and they hate each other. Let them split.
Threat to Russia less so maybe depending on definition, but threat to Russians? Absolutely.
Why are you spelling it Turkiye? I'm well aware that Erdogan has officially changed the name or what not, but we don't called Germany Deutschland, we don't call France Francaise, nor Greece Ellinika, etc..
I could believe that. I just don't see how the Nazis in Ukraine are so powerful, and such a threat to Russia/Russians that he needed to wage a 2 year war to stop them.
Lots of other grievances he aired, I am somewhat sympathetic to. The US/West should have done more to help Russia after the collapse. More should have been done to welcome them into the fold. We did the same for Japan and Germany, and they didn't just fight a cold war against us.
I wouldn't know, I just think it isn't a good look to claim to be so free and open and have people openly be actual nazis(not the twitter kind everyone's a nazi). The look is what is the issue and what gives Russia at least in my book an easy claim.
Idk I feel like after the last 20 years of NATO occupation of Afghanistan and Iraq using the casus belli of WMDs/harboring the perpetrators of 9/11/fighting terrorism kind of sets the precedent that nations can just invade another country under flimsy pretenses.
And Putin isn’t even lying ethnic Russians living in Ukraine were targeted by Ukrainians. He said fuck that and put a stop to it. NATO are the ones who escalated the conflict into a full blown war of attrition, and now Ukraine’s population is decimated. And the rulers of Ukraine went along with it because 1) they made bank off financial aid and 2) they aren’t Ukrainian.
the West is full of some of the most powerful armies in the world, and we have dipshit entitled politicians using them to make money. we go around claiming to be the world Police and get all hissy when we get too close to Russia, so naturally Russia keeps a strong military and puts a lot of resources into nuclear deterrents.
Of course, Russia is no stranger to throwing their weight around also, and so we end up with escalating tensions. These tensions not between Nations, or the forces of Good and Evil, or anything remotely sane. The tension is between two conglomerates of dipshit opportunists who are happy to put the world in danger for a few billion dollars.
The part where he is saying that the main goal for this war now is "Denazification"? Come on. Get the fuck out of here. There is zero way that Russia is afraid of
Gee maybe Putin has a beef with the ideology that killed 27 million Russians. You think?
He's not afraid of Nazis, he's disgusted that his Russian people in Ukraine are taken up with it.
The part where he is saying that the main goal for this war now is "Denazification"? Come on. Get the fuck out of here. There is zero way that Russia is afraid of like - what - a fourth reich forming in the Ukraine? That that's the main reason for the fighting here? Two years of war to stop Nazis, and he's saying that successful denazification is the condition for this ending?
This part is absurd to me. Nazis aren't the problem. They're not even a problem. This is nothing more than a political safety blanket, because it could be interpreted as an act of aggression for him to say he's in Ukraine to remove its crooked puppet government, its strings held by the West as they suck the country dry of any financial value that can be derived from it. Ukraine will then be used as yet another dumping ground for third-world "refugees".
The part where he is saying that the main goal for this war now is "Denazification"?
For the sake of historical accuracy, he isn't just saying this now, it was a big part of his speech back when he announced the commencement of the invasion (or "special operation" as the Russians like to call it).
Man. Some of the stuff Putin is saying, I can totally understand, and am sort of sympathetic to: the feeling hurt that the Soviet Union sort of "peacefully" collapsed, and went away, and that their leaders did this, thinking Russia was going to get tons of help, not be encroached upon, and even be sort of enthusiastically invited into the fold with open arms? That that's what they felt, and they now feel that's not what happened? That, instead, it's clear that NATO/The West is still treating them as a threat, and expanding towards them? That stuff is sympathetic.
The part where he is saying that the main goal for this war now is "Denazification"? Come on. Get the fuck out of here. There is zero way that Russia is afraid of like - what - a fourth reich forming in the Ukraine? That that's the main reason for the fighting here? Two years of war to stop Nazis, and he's saying that successful denazification is the only condition for ending this?
In any event, it's absolutely ridiculous that this guy - the leader of a big country like Russia - a country that clearly has the potential to cause big problems for the world (they are doing it right now), clearly has all these grievances (whether or not they are legitimate or not), and Tucker fucking Carlson is the guy that has to go there to air all this out. What are our fucking politicians doing? What is the fucking media doing? Why wouldn't they be holding those politicians feet to the fire? Why is it up to basically an independent guy to do all their jobs?
To be fair: Ukraine isn't really doing themselves any favor with how some of the people are. I know a couple Hungarians who are also not the biggest fans of Ukraine specifically because how they treat their Hungarian minority who've lived there for many generations(attempt to poison water supply, general unrest and attacks). Just one angle to look at.
Yeah there are legit nazis that are in Ukraine it's not just leftist style fear mongering, not necessarily a justification of course but if that's the shit you've seen as a Russian I completely understand why that perspective would scare the fuck out of you and you would do everything to keep those people away.
The joke is as well there was a bit of discussion about the media's reaction to this and even a few people in the media sort of questioned it. Okay why the hell are we allowing actual nazis to fight in Ukraine and what's going on? Of course, immediately shut up and toed the party line because word got around to keep quiet about it.
There aren't 'actual nazis' in Ukraine though. Israel approves of them, like come on how obvious do you want it?
They're people LARPing as nazis. Nazis haven't been around for about 80 years.
Yes, they are Nazis, those groups are direct descendants of Nazi supporters from WWII.
Why wouldn't they approve of them? Do you think all the fuss about the not sees is anything other than performative outrage?
Ever heard of Operation Paperclip?
They really are actual Nazis. Israel is just willing to look the other way for their own potential advantage, possibly in securing energy supplies from a nearby country, and one who's government is mostly just the US security state. Doubly so, if they think they can have significant political influence. They probably think they can manage it.
They're dead fucking wrong.
If you're not sure, listen to the Ukranian Nazis talk. Even they know the irony of a jewish state sponsoring them; but they have explicitly stated this is their best chance to basically run the government and build a National Socialist state. And, they're right. They have more legitimacy and popularity in Ukraine than at any time.
Don't forget, Hitler sold weapons and food to Stalin to secure his border, even while ranting about Judeo-Bolshevism, and how big of a threat the Soviet Union was. They even allied. Stalin genuinely didn't believe that Hitler would betray him. This isn't the first time NatSocs have played this game.
That is such a difficult subject for Americans. I talked about Ostis to someone here, and they had no idea there were Germans in places like Poland and the Ukraine. They know there are German villages in the US, but have a hard time believing it can be like that all over.
Germans out of Denmark!
Leave the Danes alone!
It's not difficult for me. If Putin, or whoever, wanted to show me evidence that there are Neo-Nazi types - and not just a couple, but huge amounts - in the Ukraine, and that they are causing problems for ethnic Russians, I could believe that.
That's a far crying from saying that the problem is so bad that you need to wage a massive two year war killing hundreds of thousands over Nazis? What sort of power do these Nazis have there? What are they doing to Russia/Russians?
Russia’s “massive two year war” isn’t against Ukraine. Without untold billions in cash and weapons, Ukraine would have folded in three months. Russia is at war with NATO. Ukraine are simply providing the meat for the grinder. And it’s no skin off the Ukrainian government’s back; they’re skimming billions, and they aren’t even Ukrainian.
Besides shelling the Russian speakers in Luhansk and Donetsz for the last ten years?
They've been bombing and mortaring and politically suppressing and linguistically suppressing the eastern russian speaking provinces (and the small hungarian enclave in the west aint all too happy with their treatment either) for a long time.
Azov had been at war with them long before Russia officially came in in 2022
If you ignore the fake new official borders drawn up on maps by the west, like in Africa, and think more along actual nation lines, then yeah I do see why some of these fights start, and they had been at war with Russians before 2022. People don't like to be forced together, and when you do it, one oppresses the other. The swiss are 3 different nations who joined together voluntarily. The Ukraine is 3 who have been forced together, and they hate each other. Let them split.
Threat to Russia less so maybe depending on definition, but threat to Russians? Absolutely.
Ask a turk and a greek about how they think about the other...it's hilarious.
Why are you spelling it Turkiye? I'm well aware that Erdogan has officially changed the name or what not, but we don't called Germany Deutschland, we don't call France Francaise, nor Greece Ellinika, etc..
I could believe that. I just don't see how the Nazis in Ukraine are so powerful, and such a threat to Russia/Russians that he needed to wage a 2 year war to stop them.
Lots of other grievances he aired, I am somewhat sympathetic to. The US/West should have done more to help Russia after the collapse. More should have been done to welcome them into the fold. We did the same for Japan and Germany, and they didn't just fight a cold war against us.
The Nazis aren’t a threat to Russia. They’re a threat to the many Russians who live in Ukraine. Putin is protecting his people.
I wouldn't know, I just think it isn't a good look to claim to be so free and open and have people openly be actual nazis(not the twitter kind everyone's a nazi). The look is what is the issue and what gives Russia at least in my book an easy claim.
Idk I feel like after the last 20 years of NATO occupation of Afghanistan and Iraq using the casus belli of WMDs/harboring the perpetrators of 9/11/fighting terrorism kind of sets the precedent that nations can just invade another country under flimsy pretenses.
And Putin isn’t even lying ethnic Russians living in Ukraine were targeted by Ukrainians. He said fuck that and put a stop to it. NATO are the ones who escalated the conflict into a full blown war of attrition, and now Ukraine’s population is decimated. And the rulers of Ukraine went along with it because 1) they made bank off financial aid and 2) they aren’t Ukrainian.
the West is full of some of the most powerful armies in the world, and we have dipshit entitled politicians using them to make money. we go around claiming to be the world Police and get all hissy when we get too close to Russia, so naturally Russia keeps a strong military and puts a lot of resources into nuclear deterrents.
Of course, Russia is no stranger to throwing their weight around also, and so we end up with escalating tensions. These tensions not between Nations, or the forces of Good and Evil, or anything remotely sane. The tension is between two conglomerates of dipshit opportunists who are happy to put the world in danger for a few billion dollars.
Gee maybe Putin has a beef with the ideology that killed 27 million Russians. You think?
He's not afraid of Nazis, he's disgusted that his Russian people in Ukraine are taken up with it.
Putin also had an older brother who died in the siege of Leningrad before Putin was born.
Is it really more ridiculous than the US claiming it invaded and occupied Iraq because of "terrorists"?
This part is absurd to me. Nazis aren't the problem. They're not even a problem. This is nothing more than a political safety blanket, because it could be interpreted as an act of aggression for him to say he's in Ukraine to remove its crooked puppet government, its strings held by the West as they suck the country dry of any financial value that can be derived from it. Ukraine will then be used as yet another dumping ground for third-world "refugees".
For the sake of historical accuracy, he isn't just saying this now, it was a big part of his speech back when he announced the commencement of the invasion (or "special operation" as the Russians like to call it).