This is why I don't feel guilty about "stealing" money from PayPal. That is to say, someone overcharged me $100 once (don't remember the context, but I think it was a service or late payment fee - had already paid for the product) and took it out of PayPal. It was a one-time charge so I never expected PayPal to pay them whatever they charge after that, but they did. So I just cancelled my account. They harassed me for a few years and gave up.
Now I had opportunity to take even more from them but didn't. Years later my account (not being used) was stolen by what I assume were some Indian scammers. I got it back but the scammers had spent $3000 for something. Not only did their fraud team charge back the $3000 to zero the account - they accidentally added another $3000 to my balance and - since I told them to really close the account this time - sent me a check for $3000. I was tempted to spend it but didn't want them coming after me for that much so I just voided it. I called to tell PayPal but the rep didn't seem like he knew what he was doing so they probably still think they owe me money.
If anyone needs an example of why I dislike the legal system, particularly the civil legal system, one need look no further than PayPal. They blatantly take people's money, and their attitude is "sue me." If you do that once; ok you get sued. Companies should not be able to do that over and over again and each time they do it the individual has to sue them. At some point it's a criminal violation. People should go to jail, and the company should be taken into receivership.
The attitude in this country is if it's "just money" and you hide behind a computer you can do whatever you want, and the recovery mechanism (lawsuit) is horrendously expensive and biased towards the party with the most money.
Contrast with how individuals who bounce a check or even skip out on a restaurant bill are treated by the legal system. But if a store fails to deliver what you paid for, police just tell you to take it to civil court.
It is kind of weird when you think about it. Either way, it's breach of contract.
If someone robs a house, but then leaves a rubby ducky and an invoice saying "1 Rubber Ducky - Cost 1 house's contents", is it now only a civil court affair since it's just contract law?
The contract is the bill, the receipt. Prior to receipt of the bill, no contract is yet formed. Socially we "accept" that the contract exists, but it does not in the strictest sense. "I would like a cheeseburger" is not a declaration of intent to enter a contractual exchange for a specific value, it is just declaring a personal desire. This is voided if you have done so before, as then there is an expectation of continued contractual interaction.
This may seem counter-intuitive, but counter-intuitiveness is how lawyers make their money.
This has been going on for 20 years. It's not going to stop.
Seriously. I remember seeing articles like this 2003.
This is why I don't feel guilty about "stealing" money from PayPal. That is to say, someone overcharged me $100 once (don't remember the context, but I think it was a service or late payment fee - had already paid for the product) and took it out of PayPal. It was a one-time charge so I never expected PayPal to pay them whatever they charge after that, but they did. So I just cancelled my account. They harassed me for a few years and gave up.
Now I had opportunity to take even more from them but didn't. Years later my account (not being used) was stolen by what I assume were some Indian scammers. I got it back but the scammers had spent $3000 for something. Not only did their fraud team charge back the $3000 to zero the account - they accidentally added another $3000 to my balance and - since I told them to really close the account this time - sent me a check for $3000. I was tempted to spend it but didn't want them coming after me for that much so I just voided it. I called to tell PayPal but the rep didn't seem like he knew what he was doing so they probably still think they owe me money.
If anyone needs an example of why I dislike the legal system, particularly the civil legal system, one need look no further than PayPal. They blatantly take people's money, and their attitude is "sue me." If you do that once; ok you get sued. Companies should not be able to do that over and over again and each time they do it the individual has to sue them. At some point it's a criminal violation. People should go to jail, and the company should be taken into receivership.
The attitude in this country is if it's "just money" and you hide behind a computer you can do whatever you want, and the recovery mechanism (lawsuit) is horrendously expensive and biased towards the party with the most money.
It's not justice.
Contrast with how individuals who bounce a check or even skip out on a restaurant bill are treated by the legal system. But if a store fails to deliver what you paid for, police just tell you to take it to civil court.
It is kind of weird when you think about it. Either way, it's breach of contract.
If someone robs a house, but then leaves a rubby ducky and an invoice saying "1 Rubber Ducky - Cost 1 house's contents", is it now only a civil court affair since it's just contract law?
You can't have a contract if both parties don't agree to it. That wouldn't even make it to court on those grounds.
A dine-and-dasher or a shortchanger doesn't agree to the contract, either.
What are you talking about? When you order food you're agreeing to pay for it. When you don't, you're breaking the contract.
When someone breaks into your house and then leaves a note after the fact you're not agreeing to anything.
The contract is the bill, the receipt. Prior to receipt of the bill, no contract is yet formed. Socially we "accept" that the contract exists, but it does not in the strictest sense. "I would like a cheeseburger" is not a declaration of intent to enter a contractual exchange for a specific value, it is just declaring a personal desire. This is voided if you have done so before, as then there is an expectation of continued contractual interaction.
This may seem counter-intuitive, but counter-intuitiveness is how lawyers make their money.
That's called a "verbal contract" you're talking out your ass.
Bankers gonna bank
moneychangers need to know their place.
Jesus: "So anyway, I started whipping".
PayPal is not a bank.
So you're not allowed to sell stuff at a discount according to paypal.