It's ok, you can still enjoy some escapism; however, you're absolutely right.
Being lost and completely engrossed in consumerism is exactly what lead society to where it is today. Where people literally can't even think for themselves anymore and turn to a glowing screen to find out what their opinion should be.
When I dropped my car off for service today and got a shuttle ride home I had the saddest conversation with the driver who was a 70+-year-old man.
He was a Biden supporter, pro-vax, and so completely lost that it was really disheartening. I left him completely speechless by the time we were done. When we got to my house, he literally sat parked out front asking me questions for 30+ minutes, totally ignoring his job because he clearly felt so lost.
He had put so much trust in the TV and radio that when I full illustrated reality he actually continuously questioned if what I was showing him was real. He just couldn't fathom it at all. He had grown up in a completely different age, so the entire concept was foreign to him.
I actually questioned whether I should have even bothered afterwards because he looked hurt. It was messed up.
Consumerism is a cancer eating at our culture. It's fine to escape every now and then but life has so much more to offer. There's countless adventures of your own out there waiting.
In a sense, the fact that he was lost is a positive. I speak to some people in that age-group who think they can have the same levels of trust towards government officials and corporations as they had in the 1960s and are completely oblivious to what's going on.
"Teachers are underpaid and underappreciated in society!"
"What is the proper amount of appreciation someone should receive for telling little boys that they can be little girls, and if their parents disagree then they will lose custody?"
Yeah definitely. That was the impression I got from him, too. he kept repeating, "If this was true, the truth gets legs, it would be all over the news!"
At which point I would explain that he can't trust the news and I'd show him the sources and the actual footage of stuff. We went though a laundry list of things and he was just blown away and kept asking, "Why didn't I see it on the news?!"
That's the part that made it so depressing.
As a side-note: I'm also tired of the teacher bullshit. They have it so damn good these days. They're not in any way underpaid for the shitty job that they do and the massive amount of time that they get off now. Why the hell do they "deserve appreciation" for doing their damn job, anyway? Do they go around "appreciating" the people who keep the enter infrastructure of modern society well maintained in working order through life-shortening grueling physical labor? Do they go around "appreciating" the agricultural workers who slave away for much less money putting food on our shelves? It's always the industries that are predominantly women that want "appreciation" for doing what they're paid to do.
All of my sympathy for teachers has gone completely out the window. lol
Did you start off with the Gel Man amnesia affect by any chance?
I'd be interested in the general trend of how things went if you remember. What was the key underpinning of his reality that he was relying on? It sounded like he believed that "The news is truth" and that was his first principle.
Well, he's always been a laborer and we never really touched upon an area of his own expertise; however, while I assume he'll very likely begin questioning things a little bit more now, I don't expect he'll actually remember everything we spoke about — either that or he'll use some type of sophistry to convince himself for why it's all not true. He was really flabbergasted at the things I was showing him. It's not that easy to break years of conditioning that people have come to accept as normal, especially when it's one of the pillars of who they are. I believe that's one of the reasons he sat there after we arrived asking me so many questions, going from one topic to the next, each one getting shot down.
If you're curious how it all began, then it's easy to describe. I needed a shuttle ride home because my car had a couple recalls I needed taken care of and the dealership had a free service, so I took it.
When I got in the car, I began making small talk and I mentioned that I'm tired of all the Covid shit and that the world is panicking because it's been blown out of proportion by media fearmongering. I began the conversation that way because it's a good way to get people to open up about their beliefs without explicitly asking them.
When i said that, he immediately said, "Yeah, they've been putting a lot of focus on it but at least they're not spreading misinformation like Fox News, which has been causing it to spread more."
That's all it took for me to know everything I needed to about where he sits, both socially and politically.
I immediately clarified that I meant all of the media and that CNN, MSNBC, CBS, PBS, etc., were just as egregious in their misinformation than anyone else — if not vastly more so. I said that nearly every single headline story promulgated by media the last five or six years.
From there it all flowed pretty naturally. When he asked for an example I began with the riots they hid, along with the "murders" committed by police and then worked through the list of everything else.
I began making small talk and I mentioned that I'm tired of all the Covid shit and that the world is panicking because it's been blown out of proportion by media fearmongering
I mean, it might sound pretty manipulative of me, but I've found that the best approach to getting people to open up is to find something relatable, something that isn't out of place for anyone to say and that's a pretty bland statement. After that, you then follow it up with an additional comment that people are somewhat divided upon that's not too inflammatory, but you do it in a way that makes you seem almost naive or uninformed on the topic.
It's all to gauge their reaction and response. After they take the bait, you know everything you need and can proceed with a conversation or let it drop from there.
In my case, he seemed like a nice enough guy, so I used it to further probe. The most important thing in conversations like that is making concessions. People love to be told their right — even when they're wrong. But you can almost always find something in what they say that may hold some truth. You use that to feed their ego that way it doesn't end up in an argument, but rather, slowly making them consider what you're right about. People are pretty social creatures who want to find common ground. If done properly, you can find out a lot about people.
But that's just my experience. Maybe others have different methods that work just as well.
Well, it was an hour long talk total and because I like to archive things, I had the actual videos on my phone and articles all bookmarked — because as you no doubt know, people constantly call those of us who don't follow mainstream dogma liars, conspiracy theorists and other such nonsense. That's probably what did it more than anything.
At one point he said, "We should go back to the time when journalists weren't allowed to lie! Then there wouldn't be a problem with misinformation."
When I turned and said, "Ok, I can see how you'd think that, but let me ask you this: if we did that, who would be the ones to determine what the truth is?"
Then he sat there for several seconds unable to answer before saying, "Well, the truth is the truth."
To which I said, "But if we make that law as you said, someone would have to make that determination. We saw what happened when they made that determination with Hunter's laptop before the election."
We had just talked about the laptop and I had showed him videos of Hunter smoking crack, the e-mails I had saved, and censored pictures that no one should want to see.
All he responded with was, "If we can't trust them, then who can we trust? I've always thought they would tell the truth about stuff like this because it gets big ratings."
I told him, "You can only trust yourself and what you can absolutely verify 100%. You have to take the time to follow a story to its source just like a journalist would. They don't care about ratings because they get more money from the favors they receive from those in power because these people own more than just media companies."
During our conversation we went through almost every huge mainstream hoax you could imagine. One after another I had almost all the information saved to show him.
The funniest one was probably the "Trump never denounced white supremacy" one. I pulled up that video that's like 9 minutes straight of him repeatedly denouncing it over and over and he was blown away that he had never saw any of it.
He was a nice guy. I just felt bad for how much blind faith he put into the TV and then like telling a kid Santa doesn't exist, taking that from him.
You should upload/post your archive somewhere so other people can see and share this stuff.
I for one would love to use it similar to how you have here.
Right?
It made me think of when Neo gets pulled out of the Matrix and he's told "We don't normally pull people your age out because you have trouble adjusting" or some shit like that.
At least he can spend those years hopefully seeing reality.
I hate what they did to my hobbies but I feel much better now then I did before. I feel stupid on how invested I was, I was basically a leftist but instead having a personality based on made up genders, I had a personality around what I played and what I read. I even had all the talking points.
Edit:
I'm also in a much better physical form and started a family. While not directly related, spending less time on hobbies made the transition to husband/ father much easier.
As someone who will hopefully be doing this soon ... how do you protect your kids from being manipulated by all the bullshit without completely removing your entire family from society and living off the grid in the woods?
No clue. My oldest just started school and it scares me. I'll try to be vigilant and hope that the kids will trust my judgment. Best thing I can think of is be a good parent, be active in their education and teach them to be thankful for what they have, be respectful to others, do not be lazy and take responsibility.
My working idea is that if the kids grow up to be hard working and responsible then they will not be ok with others getting ahead without having to work hard.
Also have debates with them on things like climate change, slavery, communism, victimhood as virtue, effects of feminism on the happiness of women, the roles of men and women thru out history, the importance of family and gender politics. This is one of the reason I spend a lot of time online, getting arguments and points of view.
Even if the kids do get indoctrinated at least they are going to be exposed to other points of view and if need be they can defend the other side even if they do not.
Early on, I was not a fan of Trump but I was ending up defending him because the critics of him were incredibly disingenuous. Up to the point I was, fuck it I'm pro Trump now.
It doesn't make sense to invest in any one fictional franchise/property to the detriment of the rest of your life.
But at the same time the culture we live in affects us whether we actively participate in it or not.
So sure consoom less, exercise more, touch grass, go to church and all that. But we still have to expend energy and effort on NOT seeing degeneracy everywhere and NOT saying the emperor has no clothes if we don't want to go full Uncle Ted and live in a shack.
have to do that AND show up at achool board meetings and local community groups
but at the same time recognize you are one person and while your personal commitments may not appear to make a difference, you are still a pebble that is adding to the weight of the avalanche
It's ok, you can still enjoy some escapism; however, you're absolutely right.
Being lost and completely engrossed in consumerism is exactly what lead society to where it is today. Where people literally can't even think for themselves anymore and turn to a glowing screen to find out what their opinion should be.
When I dropped my car off for service today and got a shuttle ride home I had the saddest conversation with the driver who was a 70+-year-old man.
He was a Biden supporter, pro-vax, and so completely lost that it was really disheartening. I left him completely speechless by the time we were done. When we got to my house, he literally sat parked out front asking me questions for 30+ minutes, totally ignoring his job because he clearly felt so lost.
He had put so much trust in the TV and radio that when I full illustrated reality he actually continuously questioned if what I was showing him was real. He just couldn't fathom it at all. He had grown up in a completely different age, so the entire concept was foreign to him.
I actually questioned whether I should have even bothered afterwards because he looked hurt. It was messed up.
Consumerism is a cancer eating at our culture. It's fine to escape every now and then but life has so much more to offer. There's countless adventures of your own out there waiting.
In a sense, the fact that he was lost is a positive. I speak to some people in that age-group who think they can have the same levels of trust towards government officials and corporations as they had in the 1960s and are completely oblivious to what's going on.
"Teachers are underpaid and underappreciated in society!"
"What is the proper amount of appreciation someone should receive for telling little boys that they can be little girls, and if their parents disagree then they will lose custody?"
Yeah definitely. That was the impression I got from him, too. he kept repeating, "If this was true, the truth gets legs, it would be all over the news!"
At which point I would explain that he can't trust the news and I'd show him the sources and the actual footage of stuff. We went though a laundry list of things and he was just blown away and kept asking, "Why didn't I see it on the news?!"
That's the part that made it so depressing.
As a side-note: I'm also tired of the teacher bullshit. They have it so damn good these days. They're not in any way underpaid for the shitty job that they do and the massive amount of time that they get off now. Why the hell do they "deserve appreciation" for doing their damn job, anyway? Do they go around "appreciating" the people who keep the enter infrastructure of modern society well maintained in working order through life-shortening grueling physical labor? Do they go around "appreciating" the agricultural workers who slave away for much less money putting food on our shelves? It's always the industries that are predominantly women that want "appreciation" for doing what they're paid to do.
All of my sympathy for teachers has gone completely out the window. lol
Did you start off with the Gel Man amnesia affect by any chance?
I'd be interested in the general trend of how things went if you remember. What was the key underpinning of his reality that he was relying on? It sounded like he believed that "The news is truth" and that was his first principle.
Well, he's always been a laborer and we never really touched upon an area of his own expertise; however, while I assume he'll very likely begin questioning things a little bit more now, I don't expect he'll actually remember everything we spoke about — either that or he'll use some type of sophistry to convince himself for why it's all not true. He was really flabbergasted at the things I was showing him. It's not that easy to break years of conditioning that people have come to accept as normal, especially when it's one of the pillars of who they are. I believe that's one of the reasons he sat there after we arrived asking me so many questions, going from one topic to the next, each one getting shot down.
If you're curious how it all began, then it's easy to describe. I needed a shuttle ride home because my car had a couple recalls I needed taken care of and the dealership had a free service, so I took it.
When I got in the car, I began making small talk and I mentioned that I'm tired of all the Covid shit and that the world is panicking because it's been blown out of proportion by media fearmongering. I began the conversation that way because it's a good way to get people to open up about their beliefs without explicitly asking them.
When i said that, he immediately said, "Yeah, they've been putting a lot of focus on it but at least they're not spreading misinformation like Fox News, which has been causing it to spread more."
That's all it took for me to know everything I needed to about where he sits, both socially and politically.
I immediately clarified that I meant all of the media and that CNN, MSNBC, CBS, PBS, etc., were just as egregious in their misinformation than anyone else — if not vastly more so. I said that nearly every single headline story promulgated by media the last five or six years.
From there it all flowed pretty naturally. When he asked for an example I began with the riots they hid, along with the "murders" committed by police and then worked through the list of everything else.
Gold right there, thanks fren.
I mean, it might sound pretty manipulative of me, but I've found that the best approach to getting people to open up is to find something relatable, something that isn't out of place for anyone to say and that's a pretty bland statement. After that, you then follow it up with an additional comment that people are somewhat divided upon that's not too inflammatory, but you do it in a way that makes you seem almost naive or uninformed on the topic.
It's all to gauge their reaction and response. After they take the bait, you know everything you need and can proceed with a conversation or let it drop from there.
In my case, he seemed like a nice enough guy, so I used it to further probe. The most important thing in conversations like that is making concessions. People love to be told their right — even when they're wrong. But you can almost always find something in what they say that may hold some truth. You use that to feed their ego that way it doesn't end up in an argument, but rather, slowly making them consider what you're right about. People are pretty social creatures who want to find common ground. If done properly, you can find out a lot about people.
But that's just my experience. Maybe others have different methods that work just as well.
Not at all.
Scott Adams has a good guide somewhere on deprogramming people, I think this is the one I'm thinking of: https://www.scottadamssays.com/episode-1313-scott-adams-wokeness-cult-deprogramming-cnn-cancels-abe-lincoln-north-korea-misses-trump/
You must have a killer elevator pitch if you can break a man on the shuttle ride home.
Well, it was an hour long talk total and because I like to archive things, I had the actual videos on my phone and articles all bookmarked — because as you no doubt know, people constantly call those of us who don't follow mainstream dogma liars, conspiracy theorists and other such nonsense. That's probably what did it more than anything.
At one point he said, "We should go back to the time when journalists weren't allowed to lie! Then there wouldn't be a problem with misinformation."
When I turned and said, "Ok, I can see how you'd think that, but let me ask you this: if we did that, who would be the ones to determine what the truth is?"
Then he sat there for several seconds unable to answer before saying, "Well, the truth is the truth."
To which I said, "But if we make that law as you said, someone would have to make that determination. We saw what happened when they made that determination with Hunter's laptop before the election."
We had just talked about the laptop and I had showed him videos of Hunter smoking crack, the e-mails I had saved, and censored pictures that no one should want to see.
All he responded with was, "If we can't trust them, then who can we trust? I've always thought they would tell the truth about stuff like this because it gets big ratings."
I told him, "You can only trust yourself and what you can absolutely verify 100%. You have to take the time to follow a story to its source just like a journalist would. They don't care about ratings because they get more money from the favors they receive from those in power because these people own more than just media companies."
During our conversation we went through almost every huge mainstream hoax you could imagine. One after another I had almost all the information saved to show him.
The funniest one was probably the "Trump never denounced white supremacy" one. I pulled up that video that's like 9 minutes straight of him repeatedly denouncing it over and over and he was blown away that he had never saw any of it.
He was a nice guy. I just felt bad for how much blind faith he put into the TV and then like telling a kid Santa doesn't exist, taking that from him.
That's the fundamental problem, the need to place trust in someone else
That's exactly what I said more-or-less.
You should upload/post your archive somewhere so other people can see and share this stuff.
I for one would love to use it similar to how you have here.
Right?
It made me think of when Neo gets pulled out of the Matrix and he's told "We don't normally pull people your age out because you have trouble adjusting" or some shit like that.
At least he can spend those years hopefully seeing reality.
I would consider this cruel except these people vote to make my life a egalitarian progressive hellscape.
I hate what they did to my hobbies but I feel much better now then I did before. I feel stupid on how invested I was, I was basically a leftist but instead having a personality based on made up genders, I had a personality around what I played and what I read. I even had all the talking points.
Edit: I'm also in a much better physical form and started a family. While not directly related, spending less time on hobbies made the transition to husband/ father much easier.
As someone who will hopefully be doing this soon ... how do you protect your kids from being manipulated by all the bullshit without completely removing your entire family from society and living off the grid in the woods?
No clue. My oldest just started school and it scares me. I'll try to be vigilant and hope that the kids will trust my judgment. Best thing I can think of is be a good parent, be active in their education and teach them to be thankful for what they have, be respectful to others, do not be lazy and take responsibility.
My working idea is that if the kids grow up to be hard working and responsible then they will not be ok with others getting ahead without having to work hard. Also have debates with them on things like climate change, slavery, communism, victimhood as virtue, effects of feminism on the happiness of women, the roles of men and women thru out history, the importance of family and gender politics. This is one of the reason I spend a lot of time online, getting arguments and points of view. Even if the kids do get indoctrinated at least they are going to be exposed to other points of view and if need be they can defend the other side even if they do not.
Early on, I was not a fan of Trump but I was ending up defending him because the critics of him were incredibly disingenuous. Up to the point I was, fuck it I'm pro Trump now.
If they don’t get pozzed then I get to enjoy them for what they are.
If they do get pozzed I get to laugh at them for what they’ve become.
Either way I can’t lose!
It doesn't make sense to invest in any one fictional franchise/property to the detriment of the rest of your life.
But at the same time the culture we live in affects us whether we actively participate in it or not.
So sure consoom less, exercise more, touch grass, go to church and all that. But we still have to expend energy and effort on NOT seeing degeneracy everywhere and NOT saying the emperor has no clothes if we don't want to go full Uncle Ted and live in a shack.
Retreating to self-improvement is great, but that can't be the end.
have to do that AND show up at achool board meetings and local community groups
but at the same time recognize you are one person and while your personal commitments may not appear to make a difference, you are still a pebble that is adding to the weight of the avalanche
The veil lifts from your eyes. Welcome to reality, brother.
Seeing a product you love getting destroyed still hurt. Just like if someone smash your favorite cup, it's just a piece of clay, but it still hurts.