Not really defending Comey, but more critiquing that Viva didn't make his argument well. "86" is so often not used in the murder sense. To act like it's outrageous that it could be used in any other way - such as the way it's used 99% of the time - is pretty disingenuous from Viva, in my opinion. But probably the biggest issue is the focus on the food item, as if that is the only other meaning, when it is probably most well known as slang for kicking someone out. If someone is being troublesome, you throw them out; they've been 86ed.
Now, sure, contextually I think this is intentional shit stirring, and I think the Krassensteins definitely know what they're doing, since they were dumb enough to put more words to it, but I don't think the case is quite as solid as Viva acts.
I think "8647" is in pretty damn poor taste, and could be taken as a call to violence if you stretch, but it's also easily viewed as 'fire,' 'kick out,' or otherwise get rid of.
Graves are 8' long and 6' deep and this is the only origin explanation that's not just random. "Deep six" originated around the same time in the roarin' 20s. It's been listed in every slang dictionary as "to kill" since before the 70s.
And do you really think Comey ever had a job as a waiter?? Uh, no.
No, this means to kill. It certainly means that to Comey.
And do you really think Comey ever had a job as a waiter?? Uh, no.
You don't have to be a waiter to know what '86' means. As I said in my other comment, at least in my experience, it's almost exclusively used to mean kick someone out.
Maybe it's a regional dialect? I've rarely heard it used straight and unironically. Closest I've seen was talking about firing someone in a joking way, alluding to mob movies, when our team manager discussed another coworkers poor performance review and said "Yeah we'll need to 86 him" and did the cutting motion across his neck. That's probably how that idiot Krassenstein meant it, but Comey posting out of nowhere is sus.
Mob movies were a literal staple of American media for decades. Multiple instances of mob slang have become common parts of American English and most of us probably use words/lines from them without having seen them ourselves.
Its really one of those things where its usage is commonly hyperbolic, but its literal meaning is very direct. And a person with the level of power and political standing of Comey (current or former) cannot be that loose with his words at any point.
I happen to agree with Viva on this because while I understand how it's used on a list of objects, it's way different for people.
Basically, it's taken as a way of saying to "eliminate" something. Through context, you obviously aren't asking for someone to commit murder, but that's through context.
If I have a grocery list, and my wife realizes we don't need bananas, and she tells me to "86 the bananas", I understand that the bananas should be removed, not killed, because you can not kill a banana.
If my boss at work tells me to "86 Steve from the project", again, I can use context clues to understand that Steve should be removed from the roster, not shot in the head in the parking lot.
The problem is that we are applying that phrase to the most lethal job in American history, on a man who has survived three assassination attempts so far, from a political movement that has supported mass terrorism, insurrection, fire-bombing, wide-range petty terrorism, endorsed his assassination, endorsed the assassination of cops, endorsed the assassination of people saying the n-word, endorsed the assassination of Afrikaners, endorsed the assassination January 6 protestors, and endorsed the assassination of a health care CEO.
The context clues here tell me that this is a call for murder. A call to "eliminate" Trump, by a movement that has been openly violent, and supported open violence, is not something I'm going to just excuse. At least, if I also assume that Comey isn't trying to get attention for his book, which we know he is doing that.
Not to mention they've already attempted to peacefully "remove" Trump by legal means and fallen flat. There's no need to call for something to be done that has already been tried and has safeguards in place against such double jeopardy. The only legal recourse left at this point is to challenge his individual orders, there's no causes left to try and have him completely removed as president.
Even by the most charitable interpretation he's calling out on the blind hope that someone finds (or "finds", Steele dossier style) another convincing pretense for impeachment, then they can start another legal attempt to "remove" him from office.
That's a very elaborate plan to describe in a single cryptic number meme. Seems far more straightforward to assume the people who have called for and carried out multiple political assassination attempts are doing so again, being cryptic enough to maintain (barely) plausible deniability.
Precisely. Even if we accept that impeachment is a purely political process and he will be impeached and removed for purely illegitimate reasons, you wouldn't call it "86 47". You'd just yell "impeach Trump" like everyone else is.
I can't speak for anyone else, but the main and almost sole context I ever heard '86' used in is kicking someone out. A bartender, bouncer, or waiter will 86 an unruly customer, for example. And that's its general cultural usage as well, at least in my personal experience.
I agree here they were definitely trying to be clever, but it's nowhere near as cut and dry as Viva is making it out.
It’s extremely common parlance in the restaurant and hospitality industries. It basically just means “take that off the menu because we’re all out of it”.
Gretchen Whitmer once conducted a TV interview where a piece of jewelry marked '8645' was prominently in focus. It's not the first time they've done this trick; '86' is one of their favorite dogwhistles because it holds just the right amount of plausible deniability that something like 'in Minecraft' never did.
Its one of those positions where the word has been used generically enough to have plausible deniability, but literally means kill by its origin.
Its pure Leftist word game, where it can mean what they need it to mean based on backlash.
While I don't doubt he wants Trump killed, I doubt he actually is trying to call to violence. I've neither waited tables or worked in any industry people keep listing, but I've heard and used the phrase "86 something" usually in the form of "kill the noise." As in remove it, with the word kill being hyperbolic.
But, this is also the grave they built and they should be buried in it. So I offer no benefit of the doubt to him.
They already have a term for peacefully and legally removing an acting executive, it's impeachment. If they're going to be deliberately cryptic and use a term that can mean murder/fire I'm going to assume it's because they mean to say murder but also want plausible deniability to avoid the legal consequences of inciting murder.
Not really defending Comey, but more critiquing that Viva didn't make his argument well. "86" is so often not used in the murder sense. To act like it's outrageous that it could be used in any other way - such as the way it's used 99% of the time - is pretty disingenuous from Viva, in my opinion. But probably the biggest issue is the focus on the food item, as if that is the only other meaning, when it is probably most well known as slang for kicking someone out. If someone is being troublesome, you throw them out; they've been 86ed.
Now, sure, contextually I think this is intentional shit stirring, and I think the Krassensteins definitely know what they're doing, since they were dumb enough to put more words to it, but I don't think the case is quite as solid as Viva acts.
I think "8647" is in pretty damn poor taste, and could be taken as a call to violence if you stretch, but it's also easily viewed as 'fire,' 'kick out,' or otherwise get rid of.
Graves are 8' long and 6' deep and this is the only origin explanation that's not just random. "Deep six" originated around the same time in the roarin' 20s. It's been listed in every slang dictionary as "to kill" since before the 70s.
And do you really think Comey ever had a job as a waiter?? Uh, no.
No, this means to kill. It certainly means that to Comey.
You don't have to be a waiter to know what '86' means. As I said in my other comment, at least in my experience, it's almost exclusively used to mean kick someone out.
I haven't waited and knew it only as "to kill" for my entire life.
Maybe it's a regional dialect? I've rarely heard it used straight and unironically. Closest I've seen was talking about firing someone in a joking way, alluding to mob movies, when our team manager discussed another coworkers poor performance review and said "Yeah we'll need to 86 him" and did the cutting motion across his neck. That's probably how that idiot Krassenstein meant it, but Comey posting out of nowhere is sus.
Mob movies were a literal staple of American media for decades. Multiple instances of mob slang have become common parts of American English and most of us probably use words/lines from them without having seen them ourselves.
Its really one of those things where its usage is commonly hyperbolic, but its literal meaning is very direct. And a person with the level of power and political standing of Comey (current or former) cannot be that loose with his words at any point.
I happen to agree with Viva on this because while I understand how it's used on a list of objects, it's way different for people.
Basically, it's taken as a way of saying to "eliminate" something. Through context, you obviously aren't asking for someone to commit murder, but that's through context.
If I have a grocery list, and my wife realizes we don't need bananas, and she tells me to "86 the bananas", I understand that the bananas should be removed, not killed, because you can not kill a banana.
If my boss at work tells me to "86 Steve from the project", again, I can use context clues to understand that Steve should be removed from the roster, not shot in the head in the parking lot.
The problem is that we are applying that phrase to the most lethal job in American history, on a man who has survived three assassination attempts so far, from a political movement that has supported mass terrorism, insurrection, fire-bombing, wide-range petty terrorism, endorsed his assassination, endorsed the assassination of cops, endorsed the assassination of people saying the n-word, endorsed the assassination of Afrikaners, endorsed the assassination January 6 protestors, and endorsed the assassination of a health care CEO.
The context clues here tell me that this is a call for murder. A call to "eliminate" Trump, by a movement that has been openly violent, and supported open violence, is not something I'm going to just excuse. At least, if I also assume that Comey isn't trying to get attention for his book, which we know he is doing that.
Not to mention they've already attempted to peacefully "remove" Trump by legal means and fallen flat. There's no need to call for something to be done that has already been tried and has safeguards in place against such double jeopardy. The only legal recourse left at this point is to challenge his individual orders, there's no causes left to try and have him completely removed as president.
Even by the most charitable interpretation he's calling out on the blind hope that someone finds (or "finds", Steele dossier style) another convincing pretense for impeachment, then they can start another legal attempt to "remove" him from office.
That's a very elaborate plan to describe in a single cryptic number meme. Seems far more straightforward to assume the people who have called for and carried out multiple political assassination attempts are doing so again, being cryptic enough to maintain (barely) plausible deniability.
Precisely. Even if we accept that impeachment is a purely political process and he will be impeached and removed for purely illegitimate reasons, you wouldn't call it "86 47". You'd just yell "impeach Trump" like everyone else is.
I can't speak for anyone else, but the main and almost sole context I ever heard '86' used in is kicking someone out. A bartender, bouncer, or waiter will 86 an unruly customer, for example. And that's its general cultural usage as well, at least in my personal experience.
I agree here they were definitely trying to be clever, but it's nowhere near as cut and dry as Viva is making it out.
It’s extremely common parlance in the restaurant and hospitality industries. It basically just means “take that off the menu because we’re all out of it”.
Sorry, but no. Hard disagree.
Gretchen Whitmer once conducted a TV interview where a piece of jewelry marked '8645' was prominently in focus. It's not the first time they've done this trick; '86' is one of their favorite dogwhistles because it holds just the right amount of plausible deniability that something like 'in Minecraft' never did.
Its one of those positions where the word has been used generically enough to have plausible deniability, but literally means kill by its origin.
Its pure Leftist word game, where it can mean what they need it to mean based on backlash.
While I don't doubt he wants Trump killed, I doubt he actually is trying to call to violence. I've neither waited tables or worked in any industry people keep listing, but I've heard and used the phrase "86 something" usually in the form of "kill the noise." As in remove it, with the word kill being hyperbolic.
But, this is also the grave they built and they should be buried in it. So I offer no benefit of the doubt to him.
They already have a term for peacefully and legally removing an acting executive, it's impeachment. If they're going to be deliberately cryptic and use a term that can mean murder/fire I'm going to assume it's because they mean to say murder but also want plausible deniability to avoid the legal consequences of inciting murder.
Well, that mutant streetshitter who can't name cities in his own representative state tried that.