I do believe men do in fact need to change their behavior around women. Men and women are different. The kinds of things men do with other men to build respect/comradery and to test the men are not things men should be doing to women. Too many men make the mistake of treating women as equal to men when women are not equal to men at all. Men should be treating women as if the women cannot handle confrontation, conflict or anything too disruptive to their feelings. Men should be aware that women internalize everything and that women don't understand how to separate themselves from generalizations. This means men should in fact be "softer" around women because women can't handle men being truly men around women.
This is why it's very very important for men to get involved in male only activities that have 0 women. Men need these all boys clubs so men can be men. With women invading men's spaces and trying to make sure everything is mixed, it has made it more difficult for men to truly be men but this is very important. Men can't be tippy toeing around women's sensitivities their whole life, they need an opportunity to be men. Try to join some sort of sport, group, activity, etc... that is men only and focus on developing male only comradery without women. Then the times you do engage with women, make sure to treat the women differently because women cannot truly handle being treated the same way men treat men because they are women and they are different.
Equality is an entirely false notion and the men who keep trying to treat women as equal to men are going to keep fucking up. Women are not equal to men, the end. You don't treat a dog the same way you treat a cat because you know they're different. You expect different behaviors and you accomodate the differences. That is how you must treat women. Don't treat them as equal to men, treat women like women.
We can already see the negative consequences of absolute equality and the lack of delineated male and female spaces in action. It's not that men need to treat women softer to protect those women - it's that if forced into mixed spaces long enough, men will subconsciously alter their behavior to fit in with the needs of women, and not realizing they've done that, our entire culture changes to be more feminized or matriarchal.
For example...
women don't understand how to separate themselves from generalizations
Obviously not true for all women, but if we assume it's generally true, to avoid unnecessarily conflict men will learn not to generalize ever. To be politically correct and avoid hurting the other person's feelings. They won't intentionally do this around women only - they'll simply do it naturally with everyone. They'll be less honest and direct, something which makes us all worse off over time. Not to mention other examples of "toxic femininity" which are not conducive to a health society. That behavior needs to be kept isolated to female-only spaces.
Correct and the men who realize what's going on and try to act what's in their nature, end up vilified by the groups which makes them feel alienated and secluded leading to depression and other problems.
I understand what you are saying and don't disagree with your overall comment, but I have to take issue with this:
I do believe men do in fact need to change their behavior around women. Men and women are different. The kinds of things men do with other men to build respect/comradery and to test the men are not things men should be doing to women. Too many men make the mistake of treating women as equal to men when women are not equal to men at all. Men should be treating women as if the women cannot handle confrontation, conflict or anything too disruptive to their feelings. Men should be aware that women internalize everything and that women don't understand how to separate themselves from generalizations. This means men should in fact be "softer" around women because women can't handle men being truly men around women.
Then the times you do engage with women, make sure to treat the women differently because women cannot truly handle being treated the same way men treat men because they are women and they are different.
I think you have misdiagnosed the issue and have things the wrong way around. Men don't and have never treated women the same way they treat men. As we know, feminism isn't really about 'equality' at all. So, feminism itself does not actually advocate for men to treat women like they do other men, but rather feminism advocates for men to treat women the way women want to be treated. This is as opposed to men treating women as men themselves want to treat women, based on the men's own principles.
To give you a mundane example to illustrate my point, a woman asks a man "Does this dress make me look fat?" The dress does indeed make her look fat. The woman values her feelings more than the truth, therefore expects the man to say "No, it doesn't" regardless of reality. Men, however, tend to value truth above preserving 'feelings'. He is inclined to simply say "Yes, it does make you look fat" (and then is mystified when she gets upset - he was just being honest after all).
The feminist solution is for the man to adopt the female value and thus dishonestly tell the woman she doesn't look fat. This is, after all, what the woman's girlfriends would tend to tell her. The proper answer, however, is that male principle here was the the correct one. The principle of honesty is more important than protecting the woman's feelings (in the mundane example above, the man, if he doesn't want an argument, might have to find a way to tiptoe around her feelings while still being honest). This is what men would do among each other - tell it like it is rather than worry about each other's feelings.
Therefore, to overcome feminism, men need to treat women more like they treat men, not less so. Assassin47 has makes a similar point - the issue is feminization of society, in which men are adopting female values, instead of sticking to their own male values. Men need to stick to their own principles, treating women differently for sure, but treating women differently according to their own male values. Not treating women differently according to female values.
Oh, yes. We are in agreement. I didn't mean men should treat women how women want to be treated because women want to be treated better than they deserve without earning the proper respect to be treated that way. I do in fact mean it more in the misogynistic way. A mosquito wants you to stand around and do nothing so it can suck your blood. Equality dictates you treat a mosquito like a human which obviously is stupid. I'm saying you shouldn't treat a mosquito like a human as per "feminism" but you should treat the mosquito as a mosquito ought to be treated which is to squash it. Never treat the mosquito how the mosquito wants to be treated or you'll just be setting yourself up to be exploited like a worthless simp. Treat the mosquito how it deserves to be treated based on how it engages with you. It sucks your blood then squash it.
But what I am saying too is sometimes guys do treat women too much like ones of guys when she really isn't and that causes a lot of issues with both men and women when guys do this.
I will say one other thing.
I do believe men do in fact need to change their behavior around women. Men and women are different. The kinds of things men do with other men to build respect/comradery and to test the men are not things men should be doing to women. Too many men make the mistake of treating women as equal to men when women are not equal to men at all. Men should be treating women as if the women cannot handle confrontation, conflict or anything too disruptive to their feelings. Men should be aware that women internalize everything and that women don't understand how to separate themselves from generalizations. This means men should in fact be "softer" around women because women can't handle men being truly men around women.
This is why it's very very important for men to get involved in male only activities that have 0 women. Men need these all boys clubs so men can be men. With women invading men's spaces and trying to make sure everything is mixed, it has made it more difficult for men to truly be men but this is very important. Men can't be tippy toeing around women's sensitivities their whole life, they need an opportunity to be men. Try to join some sort of sport, group, activity, etc... that is men only and focus on developing male only comradery without women. Then the times you do engage with women, make sure to treat the women differently because women cannot truly handle being treated the same way men treat men because they are women and they are different.
Equality is an entirely false notion and the men who keep trying to treat women as equal to men are going to keep fucking up. Women are not equal to men, the end. You don't treat a dog the same way you treat a cat because you know they're different. You expect different behaviors and you accomodate the differences. That is how you must treat women. Don't treat them as equal to men, treat women like women.
We can already see the negative consequences of absolute equality and the lack of delineated male and female spaces in action. It's not that men need to treat women softer to protect those women - it's that if forced into mixed spaces long enough, men will subconsciously alter their behavior to fit in with the needs of women, and not realizing they've done that, our entire culture changes to be more feminized or matriarchal.
For example...
Obviously not true for all women, but if we assume it's generally true, to avoid unnecessarily conflict men will learn not to generalize ever. To be politically correct and avoid hurting the other person's feelings. They won't intentionally do this around women only - they'll simply do it naturally with everyone. They'll be less honest and direct, something which makes us all worse off over time. Not to mention other examples of "toxic femininity" which are not conducive to a health society. That behavior needs to be kept isolated to female-only spaces.
Correct and the men who realize what's going on and try to act what's in their nature, end up vilified by the groups which makes them feel alienated and secluded leading to depression and other problems.
I understand what you are saying and don't disagree with your overall comment, but I have to take issue with this:
I think you have misdiagnosed the issue and have things the wrong way around. Men don't and have never treated women the same way they treat men. As we know, feminism isn't really about 'equality' at all. So, feminism itself does not actually advocate for men to treat women like they do other men, but rather feminism advocates for men to treat women the way women want to be treated. This is as opposed to men treating women as men themselves want to treat women, based on the men's own principles.
To give you a mundane example to illustrate my point, a woman asks a man "Does this dress make me look fat?" The dress does indeed make her look fat. The woman values her feelings more than the truth, therefore expects the man to say "No, it doesn't" regardless of reality. Men, however, tend to value truth above preserving 'feelings'. He is inclined to simply say "Yes, it does make you look fat" (and then is mystified when she gets upset - he was just being honest after all).
The feminist solution is for the man to adopt the female value and thus dishonestly tell the woman she doesn't look fat. This is, after all, what the woman's girlfriends would tend to tell her. The proper answer, however, is that male principle here was the the correct one. The principle of honesty is more important than protecting the woman's feelings (in the mundane example above, the man, if he doesn't want an argument, might have to find a way to tiptoe around her feelings while still being honest). This is what men would do among each other - tell it like it is rather than worry about each other's feelings.
Therefore, to overcome feminism, men need to treat women more like they treat men, not less so. Assassin47 has makes a similar point - the issue is feminization of society, in which men are adopting female values, instead of sticking to their own male values. Men need to stick to their own principles, treating women differently for sure, but treating women differently according to their own male values. Not treating women differently according to female values.
Oh, yes. We are in agreement. I didn't mean men should treat women how women want to be treated because women want to be treated better than they deserve without earning the proper respect to be treated that way. I do in fact mean it more in the misogynistic way. A mosquito wants you to stand around and do nothing so it can suck your blood. Equality dictates you treat a mosquito like a human which obviously is stupid. I'm saying you shouldn't treat a mosquito like a human as per "feminism" but you should treat the mosquito as a mosquito ought to be treated which is to squash it. Never treat the mosquito how the mosquito wants to be treated or you'll just be setting yourself up to be exploited like a worthless simp. Treat the mosquito how it deserves to be treated based on how it engages with you. It sucks your blood then squash it.
But what I am saying too is sometimes guys do treat women too much like ones of guys when she really isn't and that causes a lot of issues with both men and women when guys do this.