Redditards cheer as Ukraine assassinates CBRN general Igor Kirillov in Moscow
(www.telegraph.co.uk)
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In all of European history, there was no arson until RUSSIA RUSSIA RUSSIA.
There wasn't even an attempt. There was just a US and German assertion that they foiled one. Well, I foiled an attempt on your life. You're welcome.
I'm not sure why you're repeating every piece of "intelligence" community propaganda. Do you also believe in Russiagate, WMDs in Iraq or that Russia blew up its own pipeline?
Wow, you sure know a lot about Russian perfidy. Where do you get all this secret information?
I don't agree with everything he said, but it does seem like Russia likes killing their own inconvenient people. Fact? No. But very, very strong indications. It's not secret information; they're intentionally not very subtle about it, because that's part of the message. "Shame if something were to happen to you."
The Russian state? Maybe. I don't put it beyond them, like I don't put it past the Europeans and the Americans, but this is normally asserted without any evidence whatsoever - as here. Prigozhin and the Litvinenko case seem the strongest. But every inconvenient murder or death is blamed on Putin, and people in the West of course blindly believe it.
Particularly, I'd like to see where this guy got all this information about "leak positions to Ukrainians so they can be hit with cruise missiles, or just stationing inconvenient people onto the front lines". Where he got it will say a lot about him.
The fact that a Russia Today head said, in the aftermath of Prigozhin, that she was curious as to any explanations other than "the obvious one" speaks volumes. What makes me doubt it, is why Russians would accept killing several completely innocent people, including the pilot and potentially people on the ground, to get at one or two the regime doesn't like. But maybe they do things differently over there.
Yeah, I'm not even saying all of those were Russia, but some almost certainly were. Other actors get in on the fun, and it's then easy to blame Russia.
And, yeah, not sure about the missile strikes, I agree that he needs to put up some evidence for that, or it's worthless.
What do you expect them to do if they don't approve?
I expect the regime to not do it if they don't approve. The killing itself, if it was a Kremlin killing, was likely the result of discontent over Wagner getting away with shooting down helicopters and planes. I saw Russians directly criticize Putin by pointing out that you cannot be a leader when you allow opponents to get away with killing forces loyal to you.
Russians tend to get what they want. Russians briefly protested cuts to government in 2005, and since then, the government has been very careful to not cut social services. They protested against the electoral fraud for United Russia in 2011, and the next election was one of the cleanest ever.
For some reason, these 'authoritarian' countries listen to people's protest more than supposedly 'democratic' countries. Xi canceled the Covid restrictions after a few protests. China rewards regional governors by how few protests occur. Hell, even Nazi Germany immunized a certain class of Jews (those married to German women) after their wives staged a daring protest.
Vote harder, of course.
None of this is secret. There are sources on both sides, and you just have to weigh the motivations and propaganda benefits of each. It's absurd that Russia would blow up their own pipeline because the cost is huge and the benefit is small, also Joe Biden in his senility basically announced ahead of time that the US was going to blow it up.
Conversely, there is goddamn video footage of Prigozhin's plane going down after a mid air explosion and he was Putin rival #1. Claiming that this is "secret information" or implying that it's propaganda or whatever the fuck your trying to do is so far beyond the pale I have trouble believing you're speaking in good faith.
But please, chant some more slogans and tell me about the history of arson in medieval europe.
Great. Can you present those 'sources on both sides'?
Ah, so you're not quite as crazy as you sounded at first.
I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you wildly misread that. Even though Russian planes regularly flame out, and even though Crazy Wagner Guy isn't exactly a Putin rival, I do think that is one of the better cases - as I stated to a comment before you posted but not to you (so you may have missed it).
My problem is with the sweeping claims of things you have absolutely no way of knowing. For one, you blindly accepted US 'intelligence' claims about an alleged assassination plot that even in their telling, never even materialized. Secondly, you made some very specific claims, like generals or "leak positions to Ukrainians so they can be hit with cruise missiles, or just stationing inconvenient people onto the front lines". How could you possibly know that?
I find it odd that you would believe the arson claims, or any of the other claims for that matter, since you have shown that you can think for yourself instead of blindly believing every MSM claim.
There is nothing suspicious for you about the MSM coming out and pinning alleged arsons on BoogeyMan Du Jour? Or do you have evidence that we don't?
You want to talk about boogeymen, you're projecting your imaginary composite yay-latest-thing redditor onto me.
Yeah no problem, lemme just put together a feature length documentary for you right now. You have to follow these things as they go. I don't care enough to save and categorize every piece of media I see.
Russian soldiers have filmed videos of themselves complaining that they were sent to the front lines for political reasons, or even just as a disciplinary measure. The novichok incident is well documented, I believe the have security footage of the goons who did it. Litvinenko was poisoned by polonium, you don't buy that shit at the store. The helicopter pilot who defected was killed, I don't know if there was video of it but it was widely reported and it'd be a pretty deep rabbit hole to assume that was made up. Prighozin's death was first reported on wagner telegram, blaming it on a SAM attack. I've seen multiple videos of russian soldiers ass raping each other, with more supporting documents and an alleged suicide note. Stealing toilets and washing machines. Killing people with hammers.
I mean after a while you have to forgive me for just assuming the worst. When was the last time someone from the american government defected and was performatively assassinated? Do you see how one might get the idea that there's good guys and bad guys here?
Personally I think the war has been massively mismanaged and this trickle of escalation and micromanagement from washington seems to be designed to cause as much death as possible. But at the end of the day, russia is the one who rolled the tanks to kiev. They're the one's talking about empire and the divine dominion putin has over all ethnic russians.
I have the impression that you have been influenced by these pieces of media that have been served to you by people who have an ulterior motive.
You speak Russian? Where have you found these videos?
Wut.
Oh, come on. I thought we were being serious. This is the kind of stuff I expect from people with dog avatars. Next you'll be telling me that Russian soldiers attack with shovels, like the "good" British government asserts.
Fair point. I just wonder why you don't "assume the worst" when the US government presents you with "intelligence" about the Boogeyman Du Jour... after babies thrown out of incubators, WMDs, Operation Northwoods, Khadhafi giving pills to his soldiers, etc.
Does it have to be 'performative'? I like these arbitrary clauses that are inserted into the requirements, like when supporters of the USG complain about "Russia invading its NEIGHBOR". Because it's so much better when you invade a country that is on the other side of the world that is no conceivable threat to you.
We good, they bad.
I think the people who didn't kill a million people in Iraq are the good guys, even if they... stole a washing machine. You're free to come and steal my washing machine if that will stop the USG from launching another war of aggression to kill another million people.
I think the people who don't coup governments all over the world, who don't start civil wars in other countries, who don't spend billions and fund NGOs to subvert other countries are the good guys. I think the good guys are the people who aren't occupying my country. I think the good guys are the people who don't protect rape gangs, flood my country with immigrants & try to trans 4-year-old kids.
Of course, I don't believe in good guys, but since you insist.
Like I said, you're not crazy, just maybe sometimes putting up a bit of an act.
It was Ukraine that responded to protests in the Donbas by bombing them and shelling city centers, and launching an "anti-terrorist operation" against the people of that region.
Smells like the BS that it is, but let's say he did. What does it have to do with you?