Absolutely. The actions at Ruby Ridge were so evil, it forfeits the lives of all federal employees at any level and their families. And if you think that's hyperbole, you don't grasp just how evil RR was.
That said, better than even odds OKC was also a fed op. You got that it was an archive of evidence against the Clinton administration, McVeigh's shady connections in government, and that Air Force investigator concluding that truck bombs can barely break windows, let alone sever concrete columns. It's a choose your own adventure of government nonsense.
That said, better than even odds OKC was also a fed op
I think this call comes down to how much you think the Feds had already infiltrated and were controlling all the various "white nationalist, christian identity" groups McVeigh was also connected to. These days that chance would be 100%, but in the 90s I think some of those were still popping up organically.
The sheer lack of talk regarding them, compared to known Fed groups like the KKK or even the modern Proud Boys, makes me lean into those being sincere groups. Otherwise the media and the government would have brought indignant rage upon them ever since.
And I don't bring them up as some vague "evil group of terrorists" like so many would, only just as guys that existed who had legitimate beef with the government and were likely to plan such an action.
I think McVeigh is the hardest element to get a clear read on. The nature of truck bombs is what sells me on feds. His design results in most of the force going up, not out. Even with 10x the volume, a fertilizer bomb is unlikely to do significant damage to a concrete column adjacent to it, let alone a dozen, hundreds of feet away, through walls. And most importantly: supposedly, the severed columns were not equidistant from the truck.
If the truck didn't do the job, OKC was demo-ed. How McVeigh fits into all this becomes trivia at that point.
And on Wikipedia alone they show that the ATF was telling on the CIA agents, proving they learned nothing from the prior incident at Waco and were still shooting each other in the foot.
Absolutely. The actions at Ruby Ridge were so evil, it forfeits the lives of all federal employees at any level and their families. And if you think that's hyperbole, you don't grasp just how evil RR was.
That said, better than even odds OKC was also a fed op. You got that it was an archive of evidence against the Clinton administration, McVeigh's shady connections in government, and that Air Force investigator concluding that truck bombs can barely break windows, let alone sever concrete columns. It's a choose your own adventure of government nonsense.
I think this call comes down to how much you think the Feds had already infiltrated and were controlling all the various "white nationalist, christian identity" groups McVeigh was also connected to. These days that chance would be 100%, but in the 90s I think some of those were still popping up organically.
The sheer lack of talk regarding them, compared to known Fed groups like the KKK or even the modern Proud Boys, makes me lean into those being sincere groups. Otherwise the media and the government would have brought indignant rage upon them ever since.
And I don't bring them up as some vague "evil group of terrorists" like so many would, only just as guys that existed who had legitimate beef with the government and were likely to plan such an action.
I think McVeigh is the hardest element to get a clear read on. The nature of truck bombs is what sells me on feds. His design results in most of the force going up, not out. Even with 10x the volume, a fertilizer bomb is unlikely to do significant damage to a concrete column adjacent to it, let alone a dozen, hundreds of feet away, through walls. And most importantly: supposedly, the severed columns were not equidistant from the truck.
If the truck didn't do the job, OKC was demo-ed. How McVeigh fits into all this becomes trivia at that point.
Its known that CIA flew Andreas Strassmeir out of the country after the bombing.
And on Wikipedia alone they show that the ATF was telling on the CIA agents, proving they learned nothing from the prior incident at Waco and were still shooting each other in the foot.