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41
“This holiday season, remember Mary had a choice, and you should, too” (nitter.poast.org)
posted 6 months ago by Ahaus667 6 months ago by Ahaus667 +41 / -0
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– ExtraCharger 1 point 6 months ago +2 / -1

I was raised Catholic. At no point ever in the classes or church readings was she asked about carrying and birthing the son of God. She was told by an angel God had chosen her for that purpose.

I disagree with you. Mary agreeing to be the Mother of God is a key aspect of Catholic theology. I know it well because it is part of the mediation of the first Joyful Mystery of the Holy Rosary - The Annunciation. Mary giving her fiat, to allow God to act through her, is an example we should all follow when He calls us and asks something of us - we should make the same choice as she did and say 'Yes' to God.

You don't have to take my word for it as it is clearly stated in the Catechism of the Catholic Church (my emphasis):

488 "God sent forth his Son", but to prepare a body for him, he wanted the free co-operation of a creature. For this, from all eternity God chose for the mother of his Son a daughter of Israel, a young Jewish woman of Nazareth in Galilee, "a virgin betrothed to a man whose name was Joseph, of the house of David; and the virgin's name was Mary":

The Father of mercies willed that the Incarnation should be preceded by assent on the part of the predestined mother, so that just as a woman had a share in the coming of death, so also should a woman contribute to the coming of life.

So yes, Mary did have a choice but this choice was prior to conception. Apart from cases of rape, every woman also has such a choice - she can choose whether or not to have sexual intercourse.

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– RoulerBleu 1 point 6 months ago +1 / -0

Here is the story we were taught, as the Bible says it :

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Luke+1:26-38&version=NIV

26 In the sixth month of Elizabeth’s pregnancy, God sent the angel Gabriel to Nazareth, a town in Galilee, 27 to a virgin pledged to be married to a man named Joseph, a descendant of David. The virgin’s name was Mary. 28 The angel went to her and said, “Greetings, you who are highly favored! The Lord is with you.”

29 Mary was greatly troubled at his words and wondered what kind of greeting this might be. 30 But the angel said to her, “Do not be afraid, Mary; you have found favor with God. 31 You will conceive and give birth to a son, and you are to call him Jesus. 32 He will be great and will be called the Son of the Most High. The Lord God will give him the throne of his father David, 33 and he will reign over Jacob’s descendants forever; his kingdom will never end.”

34 “How will this be,” Mary asked the angel, “since I am a virgin?”

35 The angel answered, “The Holy Spirit will come on you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. So the holy one to be born will be called[a] the Son of God. 36 Even Elizabeth your relative is going to have a child in her old age, and she who was said to be unable to conceive is in her sixth month. 37 For no word from God will ever fail.”

38 “I am the Lord’s servant,” Mary answered. “May your word to me be fulfilled.” Then the angel left her.

Not ''would you please?'' but ''you will''. God commands, she says so be it.

Edit : Nevermind your website, which is blocked, here is the Vatican Catechism in French ( because I searched like that ) and the line you refer to marches translation, so I concede that the 1992 Vatican catechism says that... Which is different from what the Bible says.

https://www.vatican.va/archive/FRA0013/__P1H.HTM

Not the first time the something contradictory is found in the Church or the Bible.

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– ExtraCharger 1 point 6 months ago +2 / -1

Yes the Catechism of the Catholic Church (CCC) promulgated by the Pope. Search for it if you don't believe me, I gave you the reference number. I located the reference in my hardcopy and gave a link to the first online copy I found. The Bible verse supporting this is Luke 1:38. I quoted it in my another response here.

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– RoulerBleu 2 points 6 months ago +2 / -0

“I am the Lord’s servant,” Mary answered. “May your word to me be fulfilled.”

She was told ''you will'', she answers ''I am the Lord's servant''. Not exactly supporting your point. Is ''May your word to me be fulfilled.'' supposed to be enthousiastic consent after the decision has been made for her?

I suppose my classes and Church were not Real 1992 Catholics enough.

Back to my initial point :

I was raised Catholic. At no point ever in the classes or church readings was she asked about carrying and birthing the son of God. She was told by an angel God had chosen her for that purpose.

Which I maintain. The ''solution'' to modern concerns about Mary's consent is rather obvious anyway : God knows everything, so of course he would pick a woman who would want to do it, and just told her after picking her. Which still sounds weird by today's standarts.

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– ExtraCharger 0 points 6 months ago +2 / -2

God knows everything, so of course he would pick a woman who would want to do it, and just told her after picking her. Which still sounds weird by today's standarts.

Of course God knew she would have wanted to do it. But she still had to say "Yes". Otherwise God would have been forcing Mary to be impregnated without her consent.

I suppose my classes and Church were not Real 1992 Catholics enough.

I don't know what your point is. Go to any Catholic church and ask the priest - did Mary have a choice whether to become the Mother of Jesus or not - I know they will say "Yes, she did have a choice". We mediate on Mary's fiat in the Rosary. It's part of many homilies. It's not a new interpretation. It's not modern. It's right there in the Bible.

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– ExtraCharger -1 points 6 months ago +1 / -2

Not the first time the something contradictory is found in the Church or the Bible.

It's not contradictory. It's clear to me that that verse and the preceding lines are in agreement with the Holy See's interpretation of it, as given in the CCC.

The point is that God respects our free will. He requires our assent. No doubt He is calling you to do something for Him, like He is calling me and all of us. Whether or not you give your assent is up to you.

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– RoulerBleu 1 point 6 months ago +2 / -1

"You will"

"So be it master"

Much consent.

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– ExtraCharger 0 points 6 months ago +2 / -2

All you are really doing is pointing our the absurdity of Sola Scriptura.

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