prominent figures in the RW sphere are at each other's throats about their favorite candidate.
but why? isn't it exceedingly obvious now that voter fraud is way past the point of no return? what the fuck does it matter which of these is "more likely" to win when an arbitrary number of Democrat votes will materialize at 3AM? just gotta vote harder?
focusing on the candidates is 100% a distraction.
No. It's just an excuse. Most of the shenanigans in 2020 were legal rigging of the election, not the 'massive fraud' people whine about.
And there is no such thing as fraud beyond the point of no return, for two reasons:
(Oh, and I know that exactly 0 people here will be pleased by this comment, but I don't care.)
an argument which presupposes voter fraud wasn't a deciding factor in 2020, is just as ridiculous as debates about COVID measures where both sides accept the premise that COVID is a killer pandemic.
If you mean that mail-in voting or the Hunter Biden stuff is voter fraud, I agree.
If you mean ballot stuffing, then no.
Thousands of ballots with no legitimate chain of custody and you're like, "it was probably OK"
I don't know. I think you're underselling the appeal of this message.
As someone who trusts government and the establishment not at all, you make a compelling argument. They're going to cheat. They're going to steal. The important thing is to make sure they need to do so as blatently as possible, so the normies actually notice.
Agreed. I'd been feeling demoralized lately about the effectiveness of voting, but I like your message better than giving up. Voting might not get you the candidate you want, but it'll make more obvious the corruption of those working against you.
Very good.
"I'm going to continue to claim election fraud is legal, and I don't care."
If it were your country, you'd be furious.
In my country and around, election fraud is legal, blowing up pipelines is legal, and free speech isn't. If I found out they were cheating, I'd actually be thrilled, because it would mean that our 'elections' matter more than I think they do.
Kidding aside, a lot of things are classified under 'election fraud'. I don't think ballot stuffing is legal in the US, but the way they rigged the election mostly was. If you don't diagnose the problem correctly, obviously you can't fix it.
I agree with you and it's a big part of my problem with claims of ballot fraud. A lot of people here will screech about ballot fraud and then can't even describe what fraud they think has taken place.
First category are things that are legal but shady. For example, ballot harvesting is legal in California. Or ballot machines mysteriously failing in Republican areas only on election day because Trump and his supporters got it in their heads that they should only vote in person on election day itself. Or election officials that send out multiple ballots to every voter in Democratic areas in the hopes that every person will vote. I think that a good amount of this occurs. The best solution is to make it illegal in the areas where the GOP has control and also make sure the right people are in charge of county elections. Election observers and state level oversight of local elections are also important.
Second category is what I call soft illegal. People who vote outside of the county of their residence. Ineligible voters being given valid ballots and then casting them. People who were given multiple ballots and then casting more than one vote. People who voted on behalf of others without their permission. Or ballots that were harvested in areas where ballot harvesting is illegal. This also happens a lot and has been documented in various ways like the 2020 Arizona election audit and the documentary 2000 Mules.
The third category is what I call hard illegal. And that's where there's a conspiracy of people to manipulate voting machines to record votes contrary to how the voter voted, or that the ballot counting machines were rigged. Or that large amounts of ballots were filled out to vote for one specific candidate. This category is where I am skeptical. I have yet to see any evidence of mass ballot stuffing or direct manipulation of voting machines. I've asked for evidence on this forum before and nobody ever delivers. If ballot stuffing happens, it happens in big blue metro areas like Milwaukee or Philadelphia. But again, theres a lack of proof here.
I BTFO'd you on this issue a day or two ago and now you keep spouting the same shit after not replying to it.
Hold your tongue if you don't know what the fuck you're talking about and refuse to learn, euro.
Oh dear, aren't we full of ourselves?
Literal crazy people don't have much to teach, Amerifat.
It's barely a factor outside the fantasies of GOP diehards. And it leads them to overlook the rigging that can easily be stopped.
Going "no u" does not change the fact that you are entirely wrong about something you clearly did not follow and do not understand, and I explained this to you in another thread, got no reply, and you go on spouting the same bullshit a day later.
That refusal to acknowledge your own mistake and then doubling down here, is the textbook example of getting BTFO.
Nothing about acknowledging voter fraud causes people to ignore mail in voting and technically legal funding scams as an issue. You're scrambling to defend a point that you can't because it's demonstrably incorrect. Stop being a worm. The overwhelming voter fraud in 2020 was undeniable to anyone who actually paid attention.
You really thought you could fling a random accusation? Shows how many good arguments you have, none.
My refusal to agree with Mr. Crazy Person is a textbook example of getting BTFO. By that standard, I've been getting BTFO'ed my entire life.
Actually I mostly agree with this.
There was so much rigging of the election, it's hard to specify which hard a harder impact. Legal means were:
However, we also saw unprecedented illegal rigging:
The criminal voter fraud that takes place was operating at a lower level and had significant impacts in swinging specific states.
But there was also non-criminal vote rigging, almost literally because laws were designed to allow it because covid, at a systemic level that no one had ever seen.
2020 was the most fraudulent election in American history since 1960, and by a damn mile.