The said meme, which I also I hear way too often hear, is that Ukraine has been shelling civilians in the occupied areas "for years" (variant: "for 8 years"), which is incredibly annoying, because so many people who don't know anything about this war and haven't been watching it just go and believe such a blatant lie for some reason. I first wrote as a reply but I thought I should actually make it a post so here it is in a much longer form.
It's directed to the naive and guilible who just believed it without checking for what is the reality.
So, look at just any video here: https://youtube.com/results?sp=mAEA&search_query=Donetsk+military+parade Most of uploaders are explicitly pro-Russian, so you can't possibly think anything here is somehow not real.
It's the many videos of various military parades held by Russian forces in Donetsk city over all these years. It's military parades, but they're also attended by crowds of specifically pro-Russia civilians - and even by all the "separatist" leaders (military and otherwise). You seem to think they would surely go and shell then, right?
(Or, for example, you may check the funerals of slain Russian commanders with large processions in the streets, practically also military parades with lots of civilians and the leaders.)
Well, you see, Ukrainian forces have held the suburbs like Piski and Avdiivka a few kilometers away (the area of Piski being especially just across Donetsk Airport), all that time. In fact, they still do!
This is the current (17 August 2022) frontlines in the Donetsk regions and you can see the distance between Donetsk city and the cities just west of it: https://www.criticalthreats.org/wp-content/uploads/Donetsk-Battle-Map-Draft-August-172022.png As I said, basically nothing there has changed since January 2015. This date was the fall of Donetsk Airport after over half year of non-stop Russian attack, and it was left completely devastated (just totally smashed), as were the immediately adjoing areas to the east (a few apartment blocks from which the Russians were firing, a monastery that was also a Russian firing position, also a looted supermarket, a large area of car garages, and an overpass bridge that collapsed on tanks). But not the city beyond the actual battle area, even as the Russian claim as always was that they need to attack the airport, even after the Minsk ceasefire, because Ukraine is "shelling the city" from it and yet you won't see destroyed/abandoned artillery pieces in the videos of the aftermath (you will see a lot of trucks and armored vehicles from the fighting and from Ukrainian supply/reinforcement/evacuation runs) because it was also only a blatant lie. It's their standard lie, used just always, and currently used for the attack on the city of Avdiivka that is now going on for over half year too (and you can Avdiivka has suffered extensive damage from Russian shelling, and is a ghost city having been evacuated).
Now, after you watched any number of any videos from all of these Donetsk parades, ask yourself the following questions:
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Could you even imagine a more juicy target than any of these parades that if someone wanted to hit just any remotely civilian target (along with massed military forces in the open, and even the most high-value individuals) on purpose?
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So why are they never being shelled?
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Why are they not at all even afraid of being shelled? Or therwise attacked, such as hit with a ballistic missile, or any sort of drone for that matter, or even placed explosives or whatever really. (For example the famous Russian fommander Motorola was in fact killed by such placed explosives, but in the way only he and his bodyguard were harmed - they bombed them in an elevator of his base, and his comrade Givi was also surgically eliminated with a rocket flamethrower fired right into his office window when he was alone. Even when they killed one of the heads of the two "people's republics" they only blew up the military cafe he was in with his bodyguards, the cafe was named "Separ" for "Separatist" and was closed from the normal people.)
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And why none of the buildings (cars, streets, trees) ever bear any damage from shelling on any other date?
If you need a visual reference, this is how a city in Ukraine (Mariupol) looks like after just few weeks (not "years") of shelling: https://youtu.be/MDVLmOVDaOY
You can also compare with the life in Kharkiv or in the capital itself while within Russian artillery range. With the population sheltering in the metro down below, instead of holding parades and other public events.
And further check out effects of prolonged (weeks or months long) shelling by a Soviet style (like Ukraine's was until 2022) military force in the videos of Grozny and other locations in Chechnya under and after Russian sieges.
All of this should be extremely obvious, but as I said people are just being ignorant and irrational, to say it mildly. (u/AntonioOfVenice is a special victim, because usually he's not retarded.)
I can also show you further videos for every claim I made, if you want some evidence. And I mean Russia's own videos, usually (like let's say of the already mentioned Motorola personally firing from these apartment blocks on the airport, and later the large public funeral of him in central Donetsk, which was not disturbed by Ukraine in any way as always and you can see just no traces of any imaginary "shelling" anywhere on the streets also as always).
A related common lie is that Ukrainian "shelling" killed 14,000 "civilians". This was the UN estimate of all people who died in 2014-2022 (but mostly 2014-2015), including more than 4,000 Ukrainian troops, and Mr. Motorola (a very goblin-looking manlet fellow from Russia) and all of his deceased comrades were included in this number too (their side's losses were much larger). The actual count of civilians, killed by both sides, was more than 3,000, almost all of them 2014-2015. Among them the 300 mostly Dutch people killed by Russia on one day in 2014, which was by far the worst incident of civilian casualties all these years until the Russian rampages north of Kyiv (but not the Mariupol theater / "CHILDREN" bombing that killed merely dozens and not hundreds as initially feared, the underground nuclear shelter where most people were actually withstood the attack and so only many of those above and in the aid distribution/evacuation center just next to it got killed, also the place was already way less crowded than it used to be due to the mentioned evacuation).
TLDR Nobody gives a shit. Nobody truly cared when the war kicked off, and nobody is going to care when it ends and the Ukraine has less territory, other than the government officials making off with millions of dollars of US taxpayer money
I've been caring greatly and watching it all the time for over 8 years and half.
I just wasn't sperging about it for all that almost-decade, unlike the people who suddenly care now without knowing anything and keep posting the most retarded takes about it.
Thank you for this post. I have been noticing a large amount of people here lately consuming Russian propaganda without thinking.
Excellent post.
People on the Win have always been pro-Russian, or at least anti-Ukrainian. Opinion was more mixed on the sub. But do remember that not everything inconvenient that you don't like is "Russian propaganda".
There is a lot of propaganda. The excuse of the missiles being used here is Russian propaganda. Russia is not the savior anyone here thinks they are. They are cozying up to communists again, and are responsible for funding the most retarded leftists groups in America and Europe. If this is not evidence enough that Russia is an enemy, I don't know what else can be.
Is there also Western propaganda, or is it always the Eurasians who are lying?
I don't think anyone is that foolish. I do know that if the Regime manages to establish an even firmer worldwide hegemony, that would lead to worse conditions both here and in the third world countries. A multipolar world is preferable to a unipolar one. There is a reason the entire developing world refused to go along with Western sanctions.
They're not my enemy though. They're funding anti-state groups because those states are looking for a fight with Russia.
They're not my enemy. No Russian ever called me a racist, or tried to get me fired from my job, or tried to castrate my son.
Sure, but right now we have Russian propaganda being spread here, and we must fight it, after all this is KiA. A place where we battle fake news.
I know you are not. But some here seem to think it is.
It is because of the Russian pressure. Kazakhstan is another example of a country that is suffering pressure but is trying to get away from it. China completely destroyed Sri Lanka, and yet we keep seeing people defend China.
Because you don't live in Russia. Try saying the things you say here there(mostly related to press, freedoms, and other things), including being against the Russian state.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/aug/10/russian-journalist-who-protested-ukraine-war-live-on-tv-has-home-raided
Truth is, you and I have no idea what is actually true and what is war propaganda.
The organic nonsense seems to be the prime cause of Sri Lanka's destruction. And I don't believe that Russia can 'pressure' basically every country outside the American empire (Europe, Japan, Taiwan, South Korea).
Yeah, I don't live there. And they're not my enemy. They're the enemy of Western ruling classes, and for that, I say godspeed.
What we have been pointing out, as others have here, is propaganda because that is something we are sure of. I do not comment on something that I am not sure. From the missiles in Russian border, to reasons for the invasion, these are all known propaganda.
Here's a map of the B61, which is literally a gravity bomb and not a missile. All far from the Russian border, and on the same exact place that it has been since the cold war. http://cdn.statcdn.com/Infographic/images/normal/18711.jpeg
They are pressuring countries, not that many, but they are.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/wadeshepard/2017/01/08/violent-protests-against-chinese-colony-in-hambantota-sri-lanka-rage-on/?sh=968ad5313dd8
https://www.breitbart.com/asia/2022/04/14/china-blames-america-socialist-sri-lankas-belt-road-debt-disaster/
But bowing to the Russian ruling classes is better?
What specific 'reason for the invasion' is propaganda? Surely not NATO?
OK, but I don't quite get the relevance. It's good to keep nukes relatively far to prevent early warning systems from having to be too paranoid, but any attack on Russia will have to be a land invasion.
Yes, Sri Lanka was multifaceted, but the ban on chemical fertilizers (which was an attempt by govt to preserve forex and to push organic BS) was the most important cause of the crisis.
Re: Russia's pressure. None of the Third World is buying into the Western hysteria. That includes countries not pressured by Russia. Hypocrisy is far more obvious when looking at it from the outside. Seriously, the West is now suddenly against invading other countries? It's laughable to people.
We bow to no one. But if the Russians can give the rulers a hard time, good. My worry is that if Russia loses, that will strengthen the regime even further, to our great detriment.
I'm one of those who is skeptical of Ukraine simply because they seem to bow down to globalists and that Zelensky seems more of an actor then a politician, the amount of push from the media is propaganda in itself.
This does not mean I trust Russia I want them pushed out of Ukraine. I'm fine being critical of Ukraine propaganda and being against Russia,
In the end Ukraine will lose because of the deals they are making with the globalist elites and not Russia. If they lose part of their territory or not will be irrelevant, they will fall to diversity, feminism and the rainbow mafia. The deals are already being done.
Is hard for me to care to much when I know the end result.
Trump is also an actor, but Russia is as mucb of a globalist elite than any other country. Their oligarchs having homes everywhere in Europe, Putin going to Iran to get drones, North Korea offering people for the war, censorship at extreme levels, total media control by the government, out of control abortions in Russia, human trafficking and child pornography galore, and mucb more.
The only thing you can claim Russia doesn't have is the forced transgender or alphabet education, as they enacted laws against it, but that's about it. And there is nothing more globalist than invading another country without a valid reason. Especially after invading two more through the years.
Russia is not marxist, at least as far as I can see. They are more of the classical james bond villain type. Still evil but lower on the threat scale then Globalists like the WEF, Blackrock, Soros and the likes.
There is something incredibly evil about how the left won in the west, something truly perversed.
Overall I'm more threatened by leftist globalist then Russia doing deals with Iran and North Korea. They are an obvious visible external threat that is at least fightable.
It is Leninist.
Neo-Leninist, if you like. Weirdly syncretic with the cult of the Russian emperors whose last family Lenin had exterminated.
They fund Marxists organizations in the west, and fly the soviet flag as they invade Ukraine, including communist flags.
If Russia wins, and keeps expanding you can bet everything you own and win big that the leftists movements will get worse, as they will get even more funds from Russia, more disruption and control. These people are masters in control, after all, look what they have done through their population for decades(China, North Korea, Russia and more). Very little dissent, and anything they dare to dissent is nearly instantly stamped out. Yuri Bezmenov alerted us of these things and Russia only stopped for a few years while to recovered from the soviet dissolution, but their knowledge is still there. They still know how to manipulate.
Russia also has their Soros(multiple Soros in fact) , one of those is known as Putin. He has enriched himself and uses his money to control everyone and everything. He is far worse than Biden Inc.
Russia is a more pervasive evil, you are focusing on the tip of the very large iceberg and forgetting what's underneath, as its evil spreads far and wide underwater.
Backing Russia is backing our destruction.
They do do that. Fair enough. Still they can't even get thru Ukraine, they are almost nothing in terms of military threat, I do not fear them from ideological pov either, you can't influence ideological changes when your country is close to third world country levels. This is why globalists have so much success in the west, they use just words, they do not need or have something to show as proof. It can't work when you represent a country but it does when you are just a faceless ideology.
I honestly just can't see Russia as a real threat, they are clearly an enemy but for one they are upfront about it and do not seem very competent or threatening. Maybe that is their own propaganda at work, who knows .
At the end of the day, Ukraine will fail but it will not be the Russians that will do them in. They may even win the war against Russia and take Crimea back. The globalists will diversify them in to the ground. Expect the country to be 85% white in a decade and 20% of the government to be gay and 50% women by law.
What a bunch of pussies, downvoting a post just because you disagree with it, or because you don't like what it says. If you dislike how the mainstream deals with opinions that it dislikes, you can't turn around and act in the exact same way.
An attempt was made, and effort was put into it. And you have to respect that regardless. I'll see if I can make the time to address it.
I agree but I'm afraid I have to downvote your comment. I don't make the rules.
Yes, I know that he can go over the top sometimes - though if you lived in Poland, you'd probably be paranoid about Russia as well!
That said, however 'bad' his other opinions are according to some does not make this post bad. Say he's crazy and yet managed to pull of one good post, maybe folks shouldn't reflexively get mad at disagreement?
And everyone is 'biased', esp. those who downvote this post.
I actually think it's very good to see an attempt to present a good argument from the pro-Ukraine position, since all we see in MSM is just mindless propaganda.
In that case I might add that meanwhile I found out there are also newer estimates that go even higher than the initial ones: https://apnews.com/article/Russia-ukraine-war-mariupol-theater-c321a196fbd568899841b506afcac7a1
And apparently there was no nuclear shelter there, contrary to early reports, just a regular basement and it didn't hold well.
I'm sure the Western media is very reliable and objective.
Still, this is war. I didn't see the same reaction when Biden immolated an Afghan family of his own allies.
But you did, the NYT disclosed it.
I really didn't. It's good that the NYT disclosed it, after its journalist bragged right after the attack about the amazing line of intel the US has into ISIS-K, but there is a huge difference.
Zero sanctions against the US. Zero condemnations of the US. Zero attacks on the US as a terrorist or war criminal state.
Russia was helping the Taliban and HN/AQ all the time and now openly is their ally.
Even more so China.
In fact as I just check out the NYT even seems to have had more articles about than about the recent drone strike that wasted Zawahiri in Haqqani's house. There are like at least 4 different articles just about the footage of it that they got in January. And it was just a random family (they also have articles about the surviving family members).
Yeah, they bleat about it a lot (which is good!). But when Russia kills innocents, accidentally or otherwise, it's "RUSSIA BAD". When the US does it, it's" ohhhh, we immolated your family? Too bad, much mistake! Tehehehe"
You're being retarded again.
This is their newest article, after dozens in a year, from just 4 days ago: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/08/15/us/politics/us-drone-strike-afghanistan-relatives.html
They're literally obsessed with it and not letting it go.
And yes this is what Biden promised, and at least partially did. (And I don't think many here would even support bringing in 144 more Afghans, at all.)
Meanwnile Russia [T]oday: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Faj1K0GXoAMAxSD?format=jpg&name=large
Your point? You're only showing that they yapped about it for a while. Has there been any accountability? No more than for any Russian doing bad stuff.
I'm not talking about that. I'm talking specifically about what the US did, and how all the people complaining about Russia killing civilians have a very different attitude towards that.
What do you even mean by "any accountability"? Whatever more can a paper do than "yapping" constantly for almost a year now?
Of course it's a very different attitude. For one, they didn't hit a target that was well known as a major civilian shelter, standing alone in the middle of a park with its distinctive red roof and the giant markings of "CHILDREN" written on both sides like a crosshair for "a very different attitude".
It's the same continued sort of attitude that earned the Hero of the Soviet Union for the alcoholic submarine commander who sunk 2 German hospital and evacuation ships in 1945, killing more people than in the Titanic disaster.
https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/deadliest-disaster-sea-happened-75-years-ago-yet-its-barely-known-why-180974077/
Stop being such a contrarian.
Russians lie constantly. If they ever tell the truth, it's purely coincidental. Russia is an authoritarian propaganda machine. It does not have a free press like almost every other country. Propaganda machines tell you what they want you to believe, and they don't care about the truth at all. Their mission is to give cover to their own side's bad acts.
There is the real world and reality, which you can see in the steady stream of video evidence on twitter, and then there are russian lies, usually amateurish, which come from telegram and russian state media, and then are spread by trolls into western spaces including this sub.
Whenever the narratives come into conflict, the West is right 100% of the time, and the Russians are proved liars 100% of the time. After seeing this over and over, any rational person would just assuming anything and everything from Russia is just a lie.
Ukraine mostly behaves itself very well (with rare and unsanctioned exceptions on small scales) because it knows the eyes of the West are on it, and that if it were to misbehave, the Western press would turn on it. There is historical precedent for this, as the western press turned against the South Vietnamese.
I don't post much Ukraine war stuff in this sub because I know there's a lot of people on the Right in here who have been made into useful idiots of Putin's regime by being conned into believing that Putin is the last best hope to stop the faggots and trannies, but nothing could be further from the truth. Putin would throw the biggest gay pride parade the world has ever seen if it would cause Ukraine to surrender. Putin doesn't give 2 shits about fighting the West's culture war, and he just got caught funding black nationalists in the US, including that giant faggot Gazi Kodzo: https://twitter.com/EWErickson/status/1559953996495855616 & https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Hammer_Party#Russian_influence_operation
Tha' fugg you be on 'bout, nigga?
You believed that Ukraine killed all those generals... oh... yeah... only for most of them to resurface later.
Did you forget that uproarious Ghost of Kiev sheeit, with Samuel Hyde's face being shared around the internet as a Ukrainian fighter ace who shot down some absurd number of Russian planes?
I bet you even think the Ukraine will even depose Putin or some sheeeit... bahaha... muhfuggin' dipsheeeit moron!
As for Gazi Kodzo, that fuggin' pants-saggin' down-low nigga, he's emblematic of the future of America. He's about as American as it gets, and plenty of Americans being born today will grow up to be just like him in 20-30 years time: mixed black, homosexual and communist. The Chinese and Russians should give money to every batshit insane group to accelerate your upcoming demise. No one in their right mind thinks that America can simply be reset to a time before the likes of Augustus Romain Jr., viz. 'Gazi Kodzo', abounded: he's the future whether people like it or not.
Comment Reported for: Rule 16 - Identity attacks
It's weird that he's pretending to be ghetto-black, but it's not actually a violation of the rules. Maybe it's a weird Leftist troll?
Found the anti-America retard.
Anti-America, yes. Retard, no.
Honestly, I didn't dislike you guys until you started pushing woke BS on my country.
Euro's sent woke shit over here first. We just returned it even more potent
Sowing: YAY!
Reaping: HEY! That's not FAIR!
Excuse me?
How exactly does his constant racial slurs not run afoul of the rules but Imp being a tard does
This is the first time I've seen him use an outright slur.
But he does often post spicy comments about blacks and sometimes Jews.
I feel left out.
He doesn't constantly use racial slurs, and since he directed it at a user it absolutely did run afoul of the rules.
Death to america post = drone striked post
simple as
How come you never drone struck me?
And what's up with "shitskin"?
I don't have the authority to drone strike people. You complain about America a lot but you don't take it to the level of saying "yeah, I hope Putin funds a gay black nationalist cult leader to destroy America". I'd like to think that you disapprove of Russia funding Gazi Kodzo, and that your reaction to that would be "I'm disappointed in Putin" not to cheer it.
"TyroneNiggums" is clearly intended to be a racist name, as is saying all Americans are "mixed black". Shitskin is a calling him out in his own language.
It's actually what I expect. He's going to fund whatever is in his interests, and it is in his interests to fund anyone who is anti-US government, good or bad. Obviously, I don't like funding of people who actively make things worse, but being disappointed is like being disappointed that a fox ate your hens.
Comment Reported for:
Comment Removed: both. Way over the top anyways.
Julian Assange languishes in prison, more than 10 years that he has been robbed of his liberty, and the EU has banned Sputnik and Russia Today. There certainly is no 'free press' here, just regime propaganda.
And a lot of those videos aren't even from the conflict. One of them was from Syria, which was spread by all those... checks notes... people who have a 'free press' like CNN to inform them truthfully and objectively about the world.
Ghost of Kiev. Snake Island. Zaparozhiya nuclear plant, "set on fire by the Russians" according to CNN. Holocaust memorial (near Stepan Bandera Avenue).
The West and the Russians both lie. The difference is that the West has an enormous propaganda apparatus that the Russians lack. Russian attempt at propaganda are so amateurish to be laughable, even when they are telling the truth.
It literally uses cities as human shields (like the Russians are now doing in the Zaparozhiya nuclear plant). It uses cluster munitions in the Donbas. It's the prostitute of the corrupt and degenerate West. It bans Russian language media and instruction in schools. It threatened to get a nuclear weapon.
No, Ukraine is 100% a shithole. Only reason you defend it is that of Eyepatch McCain, because you think you can bleed your country's enemy.
Quite apart from the fact that Putin upholds sanity in his own country (which is one of the main reasons the corrupt West started to hate him), he's actually in the right when it comes to not wanting the country on his doorstep (historically part of Russia) be a militarized bastion against him. And the enemy of the enemy is my friend. The globalist regime is my enemy.
I'm also not "on the Right". Not the American right anyway. What have you conserved?
Anyone would. The US would start executing homosexuals if it got Putin and Xi to surrender.
Putin backs anyone who is anti-establishment. Seems smart to me. The idea that Putin would be concerned with improving the culture in the West would be quite laughable. One does not interrupt the enemy when he makes a mistake. That is why the West is obsessed with spreading its degeneracy to other countries - because that will weaken, not strengthen, them.
I agree that Assange is a political target, but that doesn't mean the West doesn't have a free press.
Good, Chinese and Russian state media ought to be banned outright in all free countries. Free speech rights belong to the citizens, not to foreign powers trying to push state propaganda.
Nope. I don't believe you actually believe this, either. You're just venting. It's obvious to all what the differences between state controlled media and a free press are. Russia and China don't have a free press. Anyone who gets out of line in those countries gets arrested/disappeared. Meanwhile the free press in the US was free to criticize Trump constantly, and then now is free to criticize Biden. The Hunter Biden story blew up in right wing media even though the left wing media refused to talk about it. Where is the regime control? The Biden Admin certainly doesn't tell Ben Shapiro or Tucker Carlson what they can and can't talk about.
No, they are, at least all the ones from the OSINT accounts I follow on twitter like https://twitter.com/DefMon3 https://twitter.com/JominiW https://twitter.com/KofmanMichael https://twitter.com/Osinttechnical https://twitter.com/COUPSURE
That's what Russians do: constantly lie and use pics and videos that are not what the russians claim them to be.
This was a media meme that was never official. Many sources I read said right from the beginning that there was no actual Ghost, it was just a meme.
It was true. It happened. The UKR side thought the men died, and only later learned that they had been captured when the Russians said so. I fail to see how any part of what was said was a lie. One small aspect - that they didn't die - was fortunately incorrect. It was a reasonable assumption given that the audio clips show they were fired upon.
The Russians have been threatening to blow it up, and have positioned artillery around it and started shelling nearby UKR cities so they can set up a false flag where they blame counterbattery fire for their own demolition.
The West has error checking and open criticism. False stories are called out and debunked by other people in the west very quickly. This does not happen with the Russian side.
That's called defending a city. The UKR side does not position military equipment on top of civilians like Saddam Hussein did putting SAMs on schools. Russia just likes to kill civilians on purpose as part of a terror campaign to break morale.
Good. Ukraine should be de-Russified. Putin used the Russian population as basis to invade. Any ethnic Russians who don't like it can move back to Russia. Every country has a right to force others to assimilate. Just like how all Americans should have to learn english.
Hey, I'm pleasantly surprised. I thought you'd take the Eyepatch McCain position on that. I guess you're not completely a partisan establishment GOP.
All free countries, so no country? Tricksy this dekachin is!
And here anyone who steps out of line gets demonized and sometimes destroyed by law enforcement. Assange. Project Veritas.
However, that was not the point. Your claim was that we have a 'free press'. We clearly don't. Freer than China, maybe, certainly not free in an absolute sense.
LOL! Russian media is also allowed to criticize Navalny. Opponents of the regime will be criticized.
Your weakness is that you view the regime as 'just the state'.
Not that Italian actor you were citing recently?
I find it ironic that you recognize media lies when they are about Republicans, but everything negative about Russia is undisputed truth.
OK, so the 'free media' here lies.
C'mon man. I'm sure you can produce no document showing Russians 'threatening to blow it up'.
Yes, in the West, "errors" (lies) are corrected by people who are marginal. Lies are spread by the massive institutions. NBC claimed that Boston Children's Hospital did not perform castration on minors. Their own website said otherwise. Who holds them accountable? A few marginal characters on Twitter.
They literally put military equipment and soldiers in schools, hospitals, etc. so they can gain maximum propaganda advantage when they are targeted, as is legal under international law.
Genocidal rhetoric.
They moved to your country voluntarily. The Russians are just living where they've always lived. Not their fault it's now under the control of a puppet regime of the GAE.
We both know why that is.
The greatest Western betrayals were of the Republic of China and of the Empire of Iran, other major victims included Cuba when the American public and estabilishment alike threw their sympathy with Castro and passively aided his takeover by cutting all support to the government.
There was even major Western sympathy for the Bolsheviks, including the UK Labour strikes "in defense of Russia" ("hands off Russia!"), and later the French communists supporting the Soviets' Nazi friends until 1941, and of course the entire "pacifist" movement under the slogan to "not die for Danzig".
I thought I'd be challenged with a barrage of demands for "proofs" (and too late I've realized how Russia's own videos such the mentioned video of "Motorola making a show of personally firing an AGS-17/30 from inside one of these rare few apartment blocks that did get shelled in Donetsk city" would be hard to find, because they've been purged from YT lately) but it turned out literally unquestionable.
The lefties also ran disruptions on the war in Vietnam. Leading to the events 2 years later that we are all familiar with. America won in Vietnam every single time, but the south had no strength to hold, and every time America fought back leftists were against it. Even worse the soviet supplying massive quantities of free weapons, armor, training and personnel to the North Vietnamese. If they hadn't and allowed America to finish this war, the defeat of South Vietnam wouldn't have happened and the many interventions that happened through the years prior, likely not needed.
How easily these pro-Russia shills forget these things, how they forget that Russia also sent weapons, pilots, armor, training, and planes to North Korea during the Korean War.
There were fights in Vietnam that America definitely lost, and I don't mean patrol size engagements. Some even by the "K/D ratio", but many just generally because the war didn't turn out to be quite bodycount based as the strategy makers bet on it.
What I meant in not losing was more in regards to Linebacker I, II, Rolling Thunder, Tet offensive etc.
The air campaign in the North was a farce since beginning. They made a list of targets and decided to attack the most important ones last and the least important first, and made no-fire zones (the film Flight of the Intruder is based on this) just like they made free-fire zones in the South (and in Cambodia and Laos). They were also sending Phantoms to attack bridges with their 20 mm cannons and so on, they lost many aircraft on absolutely absurd missions. (They were also really bad at hitting the bridges, until the laser guided bombs came around eventually.)
Tet if you look into it included a lot of American local defeats. Many of them got overlooked, for example ironically the iconic and "misreported" embassy assualt might have killed like 2 Americans at the gate and that's about it (while the entire VC commando squad was then killed in the garden except one who was captured) but a responding column of the MPs in jeeps and trucks was ambushed on the way and just wasted. There's an aftermath video of it by the Marine cameraman (and you can now find it in YT in a perfect HD, along with lots of rare Vietnam videos, due to scanners combing public domain military archives) but at the time it didn't even make into the TV news at all.