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51
Jocko has survivors of the USS Liberty on to tell their story (jockopodcast.com)
posted 3 years ago by acp_k2win 3 years ago by acp_k2win +55 / -4
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– DomitiusOfMassilia 1 point 3 years ago +3 / -2

It wasn't an "accident" because they intentionally targeted the ship. They just misidentified it.

Very long story short: the Israeli Navy misidentified the boat as Egyptian. The pilots were designated to target the boat, were even concerned that it could have been American (they couldn't see the flag from the altitude that they were at), and their mission was already to target almost anything that moved in Egypt. So they lit it up with several gun runs until it became clear that it was an American ship and the Israeli navy had completely fucked up.

The Israelis actually did try to help the ship afterwards but because the liberty was a) a spy ship, and b) just been attacked by the Israelis, they didn't let them help and returned to the fleet.

It's not like friendly fire can't happen. This kind of shit happens a lot more than people want to believe. There's a reason more people died in the Gulf War from friendly fire, than from enemy fire.

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– acp_k2win [S] 9 points 3 years ago +10 / -1

The day of the attack was “a beautiful day,” recalled Lewis. Israeli planes had flown over the Liberty nine times prior to the strike, including once that was so close that sailors were able to see and wave to the pilots, Lewis said. It was apparent that Israel knew who the Liberty was.

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– Gizortnik 1 point 3 years ago +3 / -2

They really didn't.

Going off my other comment...

  • Homeland - Callsign of Air Controllers
  • Samuel Kislev - Chief Air Controller at Kirya, this is the controller who actually orders the initial attack on the Liberty.
  • Gloria - Deputy Chief Air Controller at Kirya
  • Menorah - Flight of Four Mirage IICJs armed with several 500 lbs bombs. They are a kind of priority flight for all the air-controllers since they are delivering a strike package of some sort elsewhere against Egypt.
  • Menachem: Chief Air Controller at Air Control South (near the Sinai border)
  • Yigal: Deputy Chief Air Controller at Air Control South
  • Robert: Chief Air Controller at Air Control Central (25 miles south of Tel Aviv)
  • Shimon: Deputy Chief Air Controller at Air Control Central
  • Kursa: Callsign for the two Israeli fighters who made the initial attack
  • Royal: Callsign of two Israeli fighters who made the 2nd attack
  • Migdal: Only Israeli Torpedo boat with a working radio
  • Chalon: A single Mirage IICJ

The transcript from the flight controllers, starting at 1343, Saini Time

Unknown: Navy recieved a report that two miles at sea, off El Arish, thre is something that's pounding El Arish. Their torpedo boats are going towards there.

Gloria: I heard. I took helicopters from El Arish. I spoke withhim. He went out to have a look and says he doesn't see a thing.

Unknown: There's contact witht he field but not within the city.

Kislev: Yigal, have Chalon take a look.

Yigal: Chalon.

Kislev: Clear.

Shimon: Robert, have him take a look. He's circling the same area.

Kislev: Can you see him, Shimon?

Shimon: Yeah. Sure, Yigal, can you see route 4? Have you informed him of 20,000 feet altitude?

Unknown: Do you have Tiyeh 39 10? [Tiyeh is the phonetic pronunciation of the 9th letter of the hebrew alphabet. This is a grid location.]

Unknown: Tiyeh 39 10, one moment.

Kursa: We're switching to military power. Affirmative, northern direction. Fuel okay, 3000 [the Kursa flight has just been directed towards what would end up being the Liberty].

Yigal: Robert, where is Menorah now?

Kislev: Forget about Menorah. Yigal, you have a ship at 26 [this is a site designation]. Take Kursa over there. If it's a warship, then blast it.

That last command was given at 1350. It took a grand total of 7 minutes for the first flight to be instructed to fire upon the ship that is actually the Liberty. The Air Controllers don't know it's American, and the Israeli Navy has mistaken her for a destroyer that's shelling a ground position. The pilots who were ordered to attack her, don't even have her on their radar yet.

Just to be clear on how silly this kind of is, Kursa would be asked by the patrol boats who'd launched the attack to identify the ship.

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– deleted 1 point 3 years ago +1 / -0
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– deleted 1 point 3 years ago +4 / -3
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– Gizortnik 1 point 3 years ago +2 / -1

The audio tapes of the pilots never record that they saw the flag, nor that they were so close that they could simply wave at the ship. They were under the impression that it was a likely hostile ship from the very beginning.

The "Royal" attack group that made the 2nd attack said they were circling at 15,000 feet before making her attack run. They even misidentified that there was no flag on the ship, because it had been shot off in the first attack.

The first moment that the Israelis started to figure out that it wasn't an Egyptian ship is when when the pilots read back the incorrect identification markings for the ship, which used Roman numerals and letters. All Egyptian military ships at the time used Arabic script:

  • Homeland - Callsign of Air Controllers
  • Samuel Kislev - Chief Air Controller at Kirya, this is the controller who actually orders the initial attack on the Liberty.
  • Menachem: Chief Air Controller at Air Control South (near the Sinai border)
  • Robert: Chief Air Controller at Air Control Central (25 miles south of Tel Aviv)
  • Kursa: Callsign for the two Israeli fighters who made the initial attack
  • Royal: Callsign of two Israeli fighters who made the 2nd attack
  • GTR-5 - Identification marking of USS Liberty, will be mistaken for CTR-5 and CSR-5

Several minutes earlier, the Israeli Navy had misidentified the Liberty as an Egyptian Destroyer that was firing shells on Israeli positions near the coast. The Israeli Navy had already deployed torpedo boats before they notified Israeli Air Controllers of the ship's existence. This came up to the air controllers, and the first flight "Kursa" offered to assist the navy. The navy identified it as some kind of military ship, and Kislev ordered Kursa to engage it if it was a military ship of any kind. Everyone just kinda relied on the navy to have identified it correctly.

Kislev would also dispatch Flight "Royal" a few minutes later. Royal had been cleared to use Napalm against the ship.

The Navy is actually attempting to capture the ship, while the Air Force is attempting to destroy it entirely. The fact that the ship has not returned fire on Royal has actually caused both Royal and Kislev to get better identification on the ship.

Royal: Homeland from Royal, do you read me? Pay attention: this ship's markings are Charlie Tango Romeo 5. Pay attention, Homeland, Charlie Tango Romeo 5. There is no flag on her! She looks like a minesweeper with that marking. Roger, I'm leaving her. I'm staying around one more minute. [These are the fighter pilots themselves who have just finished the 2nd attack on the Liberty. The reason they are emphasizing Charlie, Tango, Romeo, 5, is because Egyptian ships use Arabic script.]

Robert: Menachem, has Royal come out?

Menachem: Not yet.

Robert: What height? What height is Royal reaching?

Menachem: Charlie Senator Romeo [That's not a height, but Menachem might have just figured it out. Also, he screwed up the phonetic identification of T with S]

Kislev: Leave her! [It was at this moment, Kislev knew, he fucked up.]

Robert: Leave her? What ship is this?

Kislev: Leave her! Menachem, report the approximate damage. Nixon Flight to her [original] mission." [Nixon flight was possibly a 3rd flight that Kislev himself was about to order a 3rd attack on the Liberty]

Royal: Homeland, 5 by 5, there's external fire on her, a lot of hits on her upper parts. People are jumping into the water. [This was actually not true, probably another misidentificaiton] She's not shooting at all. She has hardly any armaments on her. She's going full steam toward the north.

Kislev: Shimon, Robert, we're sending two helicopters to them. [These are the attempted rescue helicopters]

Robert: Okay, clear. I'm sending helicopters.

Menachem:* Kislev, what country?

Kislev: Possibly American.

Just to be clear, the man who ordered the attack, and the people who had fired on her, were the first people to figure out that it wasn't Egyptian. And they still got the identification wrong.

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– RealDrJester -3 points 3 years ago +1 / -4

Because the plane was actually looking for Egyptian submarines and didn't even report it. Plus that was a noratlas. Slow lumbering plane.

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