Let’s stop pretending the Jedi were the good guys.
No, the Sith weren’t “better.” But the Jedi weren’t righteous defenders of peace either — they were a bloated, dogmatic, authoritarian religious order that got exactly what was coming to them. The prequels (and Clone Wars) don’t accidentally make them look bad — it’s intentional.
Their fall wasn’t some noble tragedy. It was a necessary collapse of a corrupt institution that had lost its way.
- Emotional repression = cult tactics
The Jedi Order indoctrinated kids from a young age, stripped them of attachments, and taught them that love, fear, and grief were sins. That’s not enlightenment — that’s emotional sterilization. They literally banned families and told people not to feel things. That’s not wisdom. That’s psychological abuse.
- "We're the good guys!" — while leading war crimes
The Jedi became generals in a manufactured war they didn’t understand. They weren’t peacekeepers anymore — they were the Republic’s hitmen. They fought a fake war on behalf of a corrupt regime, playing right into Palpatine’s hands. And instead of questioning it, they just followed orders. Sound familiar?
- Their arrogance blinded them
They were so convinced of their own moral superiority that they couldn’t see reality. Palpatine sat right next to them for years and they didn’t even notice. Why? Because they thought their own “purity” made them immune to corruption. That’s classic institutional hubris.
- The Jedi Code was broken beyond repair
No attachments. No passion. No questioning the Council. No thinking for yourself. Obey the Order or be cast out. That’s not a religion. That’s a control system. They punished any deviation and treated dissent like a virus — including from the "Chosen One" they claimed to believe in.
- Anakin was their creation, and their failure
They took a traumatized kid, filled him with contradictions, used him as a pawn, and then acted surprised when he broke. They feared his power, refused to trust him, and shoved him between blind loyalty and impossible expectations. And then they called him the traitor.
Bottom line:
The Jedi fell not because of the Sith, but because they became everything they claimed to oppose — authoritarian, dogmatic, inflexible, and blind. They moralized control, pathologized emotion, and propped up a decaying Republic while pretending they were above it all. Sound familiar?
It wasn’t the fall of heroes. It was the overdue collapse of a cult that lost touch with reality.
Fight me.
Wow - so the above was written by ChatGPT, obviously, but here’s why I had to post it:
Absolutely. Here's a version tailored for communities.win/c/KotakuInAction2, which leans anti-authoritarian, highly skeptical of institutions, and critical of legacy media and ideological dogmatism. The tone here is more cynical, with an emphasis on institutional rot, hypocrisy, and control — all things that tie in perfectly with a critique of the Jedi Order.
That’s freaky ain’t it? It’s got this place pegged lol
Don’t agree? Fight me - lmfao
Yeah, kind of how I feel. There needs to be some suspension of disbelief, but you can just say one side is good and the other is bad, because it's fiction, and it seems like that's how that particular universe is laid out. There were some imperfect people, but that doesn't (necessarily) make them less of the Good Guys. Good Guys can still fail. Luke - who no one really argues was a bad guy - failed repeatedly.
If I was to level any accusation against the Jedi (which is mostly post hoc fart-sniffing, as someone else mentioned), it would be the whole 'starting really young thing.' Everything else can be assumed voluntary, if a little cultish, but since they're taken as kids it's no longer voluntary, so that gets pretty dang murky. That's the main one that's morally questionable. Most of the other complaints come down to...competence. And, yeah, there's plenty of criticism to throw at the Jedis and the Council on that front, no question. In my opinion they tried to keep order and stability, and just failed at it, in a pretty spectacular fashion. After quite a lot of success, too, though, if I recall correctly. Basically, it's just your standard death of an empire...or in this case death of a republic. It would have happened with or without the Jedi, and probably fallen apart sooner without them.
The other issue with the 'are the Jedis the good guys' question is, how much of it comes down to nuance, and how much to sloppy writing? Lastly, you also have to ask if, in universe, some of their worse actions still make sense. They're afraid - rightly or wrongly - that someone too controlled by their emotions would abuse the force, so in that regard they think they have to start Jedis very young.
Anyway, it's a fun discussion - sort of - but I agree with you and others that it's mostly just nuance-hunting for the sake of it. In universe; Jedis are Good, Sith are Bad. There can be redemption or falling to the dark, so there can be some movement back and forth, but the Jedis are still the good guys, if imperfect ones.