It's a fairy tale. It also has magical poisonous apples, and, y'know, magic talking mirrors. AND fucking witches... Nothing in it is, or is supposed to be, *actually real...
Like, dwarves were not invented to stereotype midgets. "Dwarf", as used for "midget", is a fucking euphemism anyway!!
Actually, both dwarf and midget are legit terms, and NOT interchangeable. One is proportional to the normals of the species (any species, mind), the other is not (the ones with the shortie arms and legs.)
As in, there were dwarf elephants and hippos living where the Mediterranean is now, when it was bone dry about 5 million years ago or so.
Yes, but the mythical "dwarves" of the fairy tale predate that use by quite some margin...
Dwarves are in fairy tales from nearly 1000 years ago, before they discovered pygmy/dwarf fossils of anything...
The term, as applied to humans, is an even more recent construct.
You have the "etymology", or rather the... evolution of use of the word, backwards...
I'm not denying that it is now a biological term. Just that it started off as a reference to a specific mythological creature, and was only later applied to human shortarses, as a euphemistic biological term...
Whether midgets and dwarves are different or not, my point still stands.
If you Really want to nitpick, you might say "But surely there were little people living in the middle ages (a la GOT), so maybe they were called dwarves/that's where the idea came from!!"
Ok, sure, but I have seen strictly zero evidence to support that claim.
Frankly, knowing Medieval Europe, I suspect actual "dwarves" were probably murdered, or simply abandoned. I really, really doubt there were terribly many Tyrion Lannister's about.
Or "disabled" people in general, for that matter. It just wasn't that kind of world...
Both very large people and very small ones have all kinds of problems that Medieval medicine just wasn't prepared to cope with. So, even if they were accepted, and actually I think they would have been more than you suspect, they probably didn't survive very long.
I guess I should clarify: I'm a biologist. I know what achondroplasia is. I know you have different forms of "little people". It's not like I haven't met a few, in my time. I also know what bloody dwarfism in animals is. Grumpy cat, for example.
However that does not change the origin of the word, or the fact that the dwarves in Snow White were not human...
Come on, people. Did anyone, as a kid, assume they were normal "little people", rather than mythical magical beings??
The fricking evil queen literally uses magic, FFS... The entire story revolves around it. It's called fantasy. Dwarves and all... :-/
Yeah, I did, they don't look anything BUT human in the movie. I never considered that these were supposed to be anything other than normal little dudes living in the woods and working in a diamond mine. I never thought that they were out of the ordinary in any other way.
Where is there any indication in that movie that they are NOT human? They have normal ears, no tails, nothing inhuman about them at all.
Sidenote: may I just say that it is frankly insane that we are discussing the merits or otherwise of the portrayal of mythical creatures in old European fairytales...
That is insane. Our ancestors, the ones who weren't fucking English majors, I suppose, would have frankly been laughing their heads off... :-/
Why? Should vampires be gay homos in all disney movies becuz made up?
Should spiderman have a fetish for trannies? hes a fantasy character
Why isnt the hulk a male gigolo?
we were founded upon the defense of internet harpies taking over gaming, it would be more strange if we were to stop defending unnecessary rewrites of established lore, even if from fairytale publications.
It's a fairy tale. It also has magical poisonous apples, and, y'know, magic talking mirrors. AND fucking witches... Nothing in it is, or is supposed to be, *actually real...
Like, dwarves were not invented to stereotype midgets. "Dwarf", as used for "midget", is a fucking euphemism anyway!!
Fucking christ... This is next level demented.
Actually, both dwarf and midget are legit terms, and NOT interchangeable. One is proportional to the normals of the species (any species, mind), the other is not (the ones with the shortie arms and legs.)
As in, there were dwarf elephants and hippos living where the Mediterranean is now, when it was bone dry about 5 million years ago or so.
Yes, but the mythical "dwarves" of the fairy tale predate that use by quite some margin...
Dwarves are in fairy tales from nearly 1000 years ago, before they discovered pygmy/dwarf fossils of anything...
The term, as applied to humans, is an even more recent construct.
You have the "etymology", or rather the... evolution of use of the word, backwards...
I'm not denying that it is now a biological term. Just that it started off as a reference to a specific mythological creature, and was only later applied to human shortarses, as a euphemistic biological term...
Whether midgets and dwarves are different or not, my point still stands.
If you Really want to nitpick, you might say "But surely there were little people living in the middle ages (a la GOT), so maybe they were called dwarves/that's where the idea came from!!"
Ok, sure, but I have seen strictly zero evidence to support that claim.
Frankly, knowing Medieval Europe, I suspect actual "dwarves" were probably murdered, or simply abandoned. I really, really doubt there were terribly many Tyrion Lannister's about.
Or "disabled" people in general, for that matter. It just wasn't that kind of world...
Both very large people and very small ones have all kinds of problems that Medieval medicine just wasn't prepared to cope with. So, even if they were accepted, and actually I think they would have been more than you suspect, they probably didn't survive very long.
I guess I should clarify: I'm a biologist. I know what achondroplasia is. I know you have different forms of "little people". It's not like I haven't met a few, in my time. I also know what bloody dwarfism in animals is. Grumpy cat, for example.
However that does not change the origin of the word, or the fact that the dwarves in Snow White were not human...
Come on, people. Did anyone, as a kid, assume they were normal "little people", rather than mythical magical beings??
The fricking evil queen literally uses magic, FFS... The entire story revolves around it. It's called fantasy. Dwarves and all... :-/
Yeah, I did, they don't look anything BUT human in the movie. I never considered that these were supposed to be anything other than normal little dudes living in the woods and working in a diamond mine. I never thought that they were out of the ordinary in any other way.
Where is there any indication in that movie that they are NOT human? They have normal ears, no tails, nothing inhuman about them at all.
Sidenote: may I just say that it is frankly insane that we are discussing the merits or otherwise of the portrayal of mythical creatures in old European fairytales...
That is insane. Our ancestors, the ones who weren't fucking English majors, I suppose, would have frankly been laughing their heads off... :-/
Why? Should vampires be gay homos in all disney movies becuz made up?
Should spiderman have a fetish for trannies? hes a fantasy character
Why isnt the hulk a male gigolo?
we were founded upon the defense of internet harpies taking over gaming, it would be more strange if we were to stop defending unnecessary rewrites of established lore, even if from fairytale publications.
What is the preferred politically correct term?
I don't even understand why "dwarf" and "midget" are considered "bad words". "Oriental", either.
George Carlin's "Seven Dirty Words" needs rewriting.