Survivor guilt
(twitter.com)
You're viewing a single comment thread. View all comments, or full comment thread.
Comments (90)
sorted by:
By compartmentalization and information hiding. People weren't told they were going to be exterminated. Treblinka, many trainloads were segregated out into smaller segments that didn't know what was happening to each segment, as each segment was taken to gas chambers and murdered. Even in the camp, Sonderkommandos were not allowed to interact with other prisoners, and had their own specific housing away from other parts of the base. Though the role of the Sonderkommando was pivitol in the extermination campaign, these prisoners had to be regularly killed as well to stave off uprisings.
Again, if I am remembering Treblinka correctly, it is an extremely small camp. There is no way for them to have relied on waiting weeks for the vast amounts of people they were getting to house everyone. Even when you look at Nazi prison camps for allied soldiers, they are huge complexes. And the allies weren't necessarily surrendering en masse. Treblinka was executing people within minutes or hours of arrival so they could take another load of people.
This aspect of the Holocaust is what makes it important for study. This is a genuine industrial process. It's not just open murder like Rawanda, or intentional starvation like Ukraine, or sheer incompetence like China.
Treblinka also answers your question about how the National Socialists prevented prison riots, and also how they failed to do so, because there was an uprising.
No, it isn't. It's a terrible method that's disorderly, doesn't easily discriminate by race, and can effect the rest of the German population. Besides the fact that you don't even have a good way of implementing it. You can see the state of survivors of both death and concentration camps, and despite horrific conditions, they still weren't dead. This is not as effective as simply murder.
We can flip this around and do the same thing of Katyn. Why didn't the Soviets just wait for everyone to get sick? Because it was significantly more efficient to just shoot them 1 at a time in a killing room.
You're not getting the point of why you build an extermination camp. It is effectively a form of Capital Investment in murder as a process.
The Socialist part is enough to vouch for that, but that's not the important aspect of the Holocaust. It was the industrialization of murder that's of particular note.
https://archive.is/iSgQA
I mean, this just doesn't quite have the ring of a secretive, compartmentalized, efficient industrial killing machine.
Yeah because she's lying out her ass.
Listen to that story, not just that part. She went through multiple concentration camps, a death march, Dr. Mengele specifically, and Anne Frank specifically.
I don't buy that, I'd like to see evidence of an actual death march, first. We know that the National Socialists did evacuate some camps as the Red Army approached. Many were simply put on trains. In fact, one of the events that lead to the Americans committing war crimes in retaliation to a discovered concentration camp, was their discovery of abandoned traincars filled with dead prisoners who had died basically during a failed attempt to evacuate the camp. The German staff decided to evacuate the camp, then realized the couldn't evacuate it before the allies arrived, and just locked the traincars and left. Leaving hundreds of emaciated prisoners to die in the train cars from heat and hunger.
However, in many cases, executions sped up, fires were set, or camps were otherwise simply abandoned. A death march would have been to difficult and disorderly for such a thing to take place. Too many people would have tried to flee, way too many would simply have died, and you'd need too many to guard it. Hence why you use trains.
Second, the cast characters is a dead giveaway. Some people will know they interacted with Dr. Mengele, but it's not like he introduced himself to everyone. Same reason certain infamous camp guards are known by their physique, behavior, and nick-name, rather than real name. The prisoners wouldn't know.
This gets worse for Anne Frank, who would be simply another irrelevant girl in a concentration camp. Even if you met Anne Frank, there's no reason to believe you'd remember her.
As for Auschwitz, either some ridiculous catastrophic failure took place and all the guards were just shrugging, or she wasn't in a gas chamber. There's no details in there. I'd be interested to hear her explanation of the exact events of what happened. Methinks she didn't crawl over a pile of bodies. But I'd be curious if she literally just showered. There are actually real showers in Auschwitz. If she was ever there at all.
Her story is just too much about hitting every check-mark you can think of.
Compare this to the story of the handful of the soldier who fought on both sides of the war and was eventually captured at Normandy. His story is basically just being both lucky and unlucky, but never said "Oh, yeah, I met General Eisenhower, Stalin, Hitler, and I was shot in the head."
Ding! Ding! Ding! We have a winner!
Many such stories. I'm not saying that Nazi Germany wasn't a complete shitshow full of atrocity. The record is just really fucked. The Zyklon B gas chambers, in particular, stink to me. Diesel exhaust gas chambers, on the other hand, are at least sound in theory.
But that's not the story.
I also know that 9/11 was real, and there are people who lie that they were victims in that too.
That's just ridiculous.
You are prepared to except everything but the one component, for reasoning that is totally asinine. A sealed diesel gas chamber would increase pressure just like a Zyklon B gas chamber would. And diesel engine emissions are also lighter than air.