Each feature can play a role, but African cultures are generally Fear-Power, Asian cultures Honor-Shame, and European cultures Guilt-Innocence as their primary features.
It's ridiculous that you are trying to segregate out Guilt & Shame. You are drawing ridiculous abstractions in cultures that use literally all of the above.
Snitches get stitches. The fear-power dynamic is very strong in the AA community
No, that's a strong dynamic in ghettos and prisons. It's also shared across the world by many different cultures.
You look at things too much in black and white. It's not all or nothing.
You're projecting wildly.
Anyway, I see African cultures tend towards fear-power dynamics generally wherever they establish.
No, you look at historical examples and if you find a relationship between fear & honor (which you always will) you affirm your own narrative. You look for something universal in only specific places, and you're amazed when you find it. Then you dismiss it when you weren't looking for it everywhere else.
Even BLM trends this way. It doesn't appeal so much to a sense of fairness or honor, but instead to fear to achieve its aims.
An activist organization built off of Marxism which pushes resentment is involved in power politics. No shit. That's an amazing find, Holmes.
Not only that, but they make constant appeals to fairness and honor. You're just choosing to reject the information that isn't fitting your narrative.
It's ridiculous that you are trying to segregate out Guilt & Shame. You are drawing ridiculous abstractions in cultures that use literally all of the above.
No, that's a strong dynamic in ghettos and prisons. It's also shared across the world by many different cultures.
See above. It's not a new observation.
You're projecting wildly.
There is nuance in every argument. I never said those of African descent are incapable of feeling duty or shame, but that these aren't the main motivators in the cultures. Quite possibly to the point that it wasn't a concept that needed described. Reliability is a perpetual issue in the African workforce just as it is in the African American workforce. Not, I'm talking about a group. This is not a statement that all Africans or African Americans are unreliable. Don't take it as a black and white statement.
No, you look at historical examples and if you find a relationship between fear & honor (which you always will) you affirm your own narrative. You look for something universal in only specific places, and you're amazed when you find it. Then you dismiss it when you weren't looking for it everywhere else.
Fear and honor aren't really related, unless you're referring specifically to the fear of shame. In which case, it would be nice if you use shame for clarity.
An activist organization built off of Marxism which pushes resentment is involved in power politics. No shit. That's an amazing find, Holmes.
Not only that, but they make constant appeals to fairness and honor. You're just choosing to reject the information that isn't fitting your narrative.
Superficially, yes, they demand "no justice, no peace". However, justice is being served, and fairness exists by any objective measure. Peace, however, does not.
There is nuance in every argument. I never said those of African descent are incapable of feeling duty or shame, but that these aren't the main motivators in the cultures.
You're insinuating that race is a determinant of culture (even more than cultural exposure) you're lumping all African cultures together (even ones with European influence), and you are insinuating the racial lineage of African cultures is what makes them incapable of having independently developed the concept of a duty/promise, and you've decided that that is indicated by creating an abstraction about power & fear while rejecting the influence of other emotions and abstract concepts.
Your whole narrative is logically flawed from beginning to end.
Fear and honor aren't really related, unless you're referring specifically to the fear of shame. In which case, it would be nice if you use shame for clarity.
You're the one intentionally segregating these concepts as if they are totally independent of each other. That's your problem, not mine.
However, justice is being served, and fairness exists by any objective measure.
The word "strongly" is a problem here. Genetics will determine the total spectrum of human capacity for emotion, as a species. It can tell us what rests at all 3 standard deviations of human capacity for emotion. Heredity can determine some predisposition for emotional states, which can be expressed through behavior. However, these predispositions are never a guaranteed outcome. This is why two children with the same parents can have different emotional frameworks. However, direct environmental pressures can have a far more dramatic effect on someone's emotional state.
Ritualistically rape and starve someone for 20 years by their parents, who is predisposed genetically to be gentile, and they will not be a gentile person.
Part of the problem I see with people who are taking a genetic determinist stance is that they refuse to recognize that environment can effect genes. We know that some genes are activated by environmental pressures, and we also know that sex-selection is not random nor purely genetic.
do you believe that generalized behavior helps inform how a culture develops?
Behavior informs culture, but culture also informs behavior. Culture is one part of the environment which can cultivate behavior. A culture may be modified by individuals behaving differently, and the society adopting the new behavior, but a culture may promote the conditioning of people to behave in a certain way. It's a lot of give-and-take.
It's ridiculous that you are trying to segregate out Guilt & Shame. You are drawing ridiculous abstractions in cultures that use literally all of the above.
No, that's a strong dynamic in ghettos and prisons. It's also shared across the world by many different cultures.
You're projecting wildly.
No, you look at historical examples and if you find a relationship between fear & honor (which you always will) you affirm your own narrative. You look for something universal in only specific places, and you're amazed when you find it. Then you dismiss it when you weren't looking for it everywhere else.
An activist organization built off of Marxism which pushes resentment is involved in power politics. No shit. That's an amazing find, Holmes.
Not only that, but they make constant appeals to fairness and honor. You're just choosing to reject the information that isn't fitting your narrative.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guilt-shame-fear_spectrum_of_cultures
It's... not that ridiculous.
See above. It's not a new observation.
There is nuance in every argument. I never said those of African descent are incapable of feeling duty or shame, but that these aren't the main motivators in the cultures. Quite possibly to the point that it wasn't a concept that needed described. Reliability is a perpetual issue in the African workforce just as it is in the African American workforce. Not, I'm talking about a group. This is not a statement that all Africans or African Americans are unreliable. Don't take it as a black and white statement.
Fear and honor aren't really related, unless you're referring specifically to the fear of shame. In which case, it would be nice if you use shame for clarity.
Superficially, yes, they demand "no justice, no peace". However, justice is being served, and fairness exists by any objective measure. Peace, however, does not.
You're insinuating that race is a determinant of culture (even more than cultural exposure) you're lumping all African cultures together (even ones with European influence), and you are insinuating the racial lineage of African cultures is what makes them incapable of having independently developed the concept of a duty/promise, and you've decided that that is indicated by creating an abstraction about power & fear while rejecting the influence of other emotions and abstract concepts.
Your whole narrative is logically flawed from beginning to end.
You're the one intentionally segregating these concepts as if they are totally independent of each other. That's your problem, not mine.
Objective fairness and justice do not exist.
Do you believe behavior is strongly influenced by genetics, and do you believe that generalized behavior helps inform how a culture develops?
The word "strongly" is a problem here. Genetics will determine the total spectrum of human capacity for emotion, as a species. It can tell us what rests at all 3 standard deviations of human capacity for emotion. Heredity can determine some predisposition for emotional states, which can be expressed through behavior. However, these predispositions are never a guaranteed outcome. This is why two children with the same parents can have different emotional frameworks. However, direct environmental pressures can have a far more dramatic effect on someone's emotional state.
Ritualistically rape and starve someone for 20 years by their parents, who is predisposed genetically to be gentile, and they will not be a gentile person.
Part of the problem I see with people who are taking a genetic determinist stance is that they refuse to recognize that environment can effect genes. We know that some genes are activated by environmental pressures, and we also know that sex-selection is not random nor purely genetic.
Behavior informs culture, but culture also informs behavior. Culture is one part of the environment which can cultivate behavior. A culture may be modified by individuals behaving differently, and the society adopting the new behavior, but a culture may promote the conditioning of people to behave in a certain way. It's a lot of give-and-take.