neither of which is very brown. Actually, during winter and when they live in northern climates, both Greeks and Italians (and even turks and Syrians) are very very white. The thing that makes them dark is tanning due to stronger sunlight exposure. Even northern europeans can get quite dark with lots of sunlight.
Source: Greek family. I live in Poland--the construction workers here get Really dark during the summer.
Bonus fact: The maximum turkic DNA that a turk can have is about 24%. Unless the turk in question has a parent directly from turkmenistan, most turks are actually majority descended from native Anatolian and Greek ancestry. It turns out that the Seljuk invasion was numerically smaller the native Anatolian populace who have been present in Asia Minor for thousands and thousands of years. In fact, while the maximum descent for turks is about 24%, most of them have significantly less, the average is a little under 10%. There is a really interesting haplogroup study about this floating around somewhere that's worth looking into.
Edit: That still doesn't justify letting them into Europe. Fuck the turks.
To cover one point in that, "wine colored eyes" could be a reference to hazel or possibly brown. There's evidence that language of colors progresses along certain paths in every language, and some colors get named later. Hence Virgil's "wine dark sea".
Bonus fact: The maximum turkic DNA that a turk can have is about 24%. Unless the turk in question has a parent directly from turkmenistan, most turks are actually majority descended from native Anatolian and Greek ancestry. It turns out that the Seljuk invasion was numerically smaller the native Anatolian populace who have been present in Asia Minor for thousands and thousands of years. In fact, while the maximum descent for turks is about 24%, most of them have significantly less, the average is a little under 10%. There is a really interesting haplogroup study about this floating around somewhere that's worth looking into.
Yeah, it's very interesting. Your average upper class Istanbul Turk basically IS a Greek. The Ottoman Sultans almost exclusively married/fucked Greeks, Armenians, Circassians (white Christians), and thus the Sultan's line is probably even LESS Turkic than average. Sultan Suleyman the Great's (or the Lawgiver as he's called in Turkey) greatest love was named Roxelana. Look her up on Wikipedia.
When you get into the southeastern / eastern small rural Anatolian towns, THOSE towns are substantially more Kurdish and Turkic, but they were also never as Greek. The coastal areas, Black Sea area, etc., largely Greek.
Edit: That still doesn't justify letting them into Europe. Fuck the turks.
I was optimistic about Turkey. Erdogan fucked that up. It would be very interesting if there was a protest against his dictatorial Islamo-authoritarianism by youth rediscovering that, hey, we're actually Greeks, we should embrace our awesome Orthodox Christian / Greco-Roman heritage rather than the last 500 years of Central Asian pastoralist barbarians.
I dream of a reconquest of Constantinopolis ALL the time. The issue is, as much as I would like to see it given back to the greeks, my experience with the greeks (ie: my family) is that they honestly shouldn't be trusted with anything through sheer governmental incompetence.
neither of which is very brown. Actually, during winter and when they live in northern climates, both Greeks and Italians (and even turks and Syrians) are very very white. The thing that makes them dark is tanning due to stronger sunlight exposure. Even northern europeans can get quite dark with lots of sunlight.
Source: Greek family. I live in Poland--the construction workers here get Really dark during the summer.
Bonus fact: The maximum turkic DNA that a turk can have is about 24%. Unless the turk in question has a parent directly from turkmenistan, most turks are actually majority descended from native Anatolian and Greek ancestry. It turns out that the Seljuk invasion was numerically smaller the native Anatolian populace who have been present in Asia Minor for thousands and thousands of years. In fact, while the maximum descent for turks is about 24%, most of them have significantly less, the average is a little under 10%. There is a really interesting haplogroup study about this floating around somewhere that's worth looking into.
Edit: That still doesn't justify letting them into Europe. Fuck the turks.
For added bonus points, let's talk about the hair color of various roman emperors...
To cover one point in that, "wine colored eyes" could be a reference to hazel or possibly brown. There's evidence that language of colors progresses along certain paths in every language, and some colors get named later. Hence Virgil's "wine dark sea".
awesome source
Yeah, it's very interesting. Your average upper class Istanbul Turk basically IS a Greek. The Ottoman Sultans almost exclusively married/fucked Greeks, Armenians, Circassians (white Christians), and thus the Sultan's line is probably even LESS Turkic than average. Sultan Suleyman the Great's (or the Lawgiver as he's called in Turkey) greatest love was named Roxelana. Look her up on Wikipedia.
When you get into the southeastern / eastern small rural Anatolian towns, THOSE towns are substantially more Kurdish and Turkic, but they were also never as Greek. The coastal areas, Black Sea area, etc., largely Greek.
I was optimistic about Turkey. Erdogan fucked that up. It would be very interesting if there was a protest against his dictatorial Islamo-authoritarianism by youth rediscovering that, hey, we're actually Greeks, we should embrace our awesome Orthodox Christian / Greco-Roman heritage rather than the last 500 years of Central Asian pastoralist barbarians.
But it will never, ever happen.
I dream of a reconquest of Constantinopolis ALL the time. The issue is, as much as I would like to see it given back to the greeks, my experience with the greeks (ie: my family) is that they honestly shouldn't be trusted with anything through sheer governmental incompetence.