I mean having a value doesn't do anything if it doesn't make a palpable effect on reality. An incel saving himself until marriage is a completely worthless gesture, despite rejecting sexual liberation being a very big value many people hold. In this manner, most people who self label as "trad" aren't actually doing anything but putting on a costume to seem counter-culture and cool.
As for defending it, that's a much more complex question because "trads" are also diverse in terms of what they are trying to do despite my opinion that nearly all forms fail that basic gesture. The Ethan Ralph types are simple degenerates who won't reject much of the modern comforts that create the world they are trying to change. The "return to agriculture" types are simply leaving society entirely, while admirable complete isolation like that has a shelf life until they come looking for you. Most others are simply larpers who fail the same "complains about capitalism on their iphone" test but on the other end.
Or, simply put, most only focus on the small picture and have no real plan, or even philosophical understanding, of the big web that creates the world they are trying to reject. And soon enough that big picture will come for them, and they won't have anything but larp dreams of a shootout to protect their little corner of the world. For so many of them their idea of defending it is "owning the wokies" and calling anyone not them soi/beta/etc so that it seems more powerful, when in reality its mostly a handful of guys circle jerking without any societal momentum.
Its not the ideology that fails, its the people who adopt it being unable to actually commit to it. Like the anti-capitalist who cannot let go of their iPhone, the "trads" cannot let go of the trappings of society enough to actually revolutionize it.
I mean having a value doesn't do anything if it doesn't make a palpable effect on reality.
This is kind of a tautology, but I see your point. "Values" which are are defined by ones external circumstances aren't of consequence. To expand on your example slightly, an incel that adopts/professes the traditional value of "No sex outside wedlock" without attempting anything that might move them toward marriage is merely dressing themselves in an irrelevant ideological robe.
[...] Most [trads] only focus on the small picture and have no real plan, or even philosophical understanding, of the big web that creates the world they are trying to reject. [...] Its not the ideology that fails, its the people who adopt it being unable to actually commit to it. [...] "trads" cannot let go of the trappings of society enough to actually revolutionize it.
I think these theses are generally correct. Without any attempt to work with others and either take over the existing, broken system, or to build a parallel system with which to replace it, traditionalism cannot succeed. And particularly if they intend to build a parallel system, they have to be willing to sacrifice (some of) the comforts of the existing society in order to achieve their goals.
I mean having a value doesn't do anything if it doesn't make a palpable effect on reality. An incel saving himself until marriage is a completely worthless gesture, despite rejecting sexual liberation being a very big value many people hold. In this manner, most people who self label as "trad" aren't actually doing anything but putting on a costume to seem counter-culture and cool.
As for defending it, that's a much more complex question because "trads" are also diverse in terms of what they are trying to do despite my opinion that nearly all forms fail that basic gesture. The Ethan Ralph types are simple degenerates who won't reject much of the modern comforts that create the world they are trying to change. The "return to agriculture" types are simply leaving society entirely, while admirable complete isolation like that has a shelf life until they come looking for you. Most others are simply larpers who fail the same "complains about capitalism on their iphone" test but on the other end.
Or, simply put, most only focus on the small picture and have no real plan, or even philosophical understanding, of the big web that creates the world they are trying to reject. And soon enough that big picture will come for them, and they won't have anything but larp dreams of a shootout to protect their little corner of the world. For so many of them their idea of defending it is "owning the wokies" and calling anyone not them soi/beta/etc so that it seems more powerful, when in reality its mostly a handful of guys circle jerking without any societal momentum.
Its not the ideology that fails, its the people who adopt it being unable to actually commit to it. Like the anti-capitalist who cannot let go of their iPhone, the "trads" cannot let go of the trappings of society enough to actually revolutionize it.
This is kind of a tautology, but I see your point. "Values" which are are defined by ones external circumstances aren't of consequence. To expand on your example slightly, an incel that adopts/professes the traditional value of "No sex outside wedlock" without attempting anything that might move them toward marriage is merely dressing themselves in an irrelevant ideological robe.
I think these theses are generally correct. Without any attempt to work with others and either take over the existing, broken system, or to build a parallel system with which to replace it, traditionalism cannot succeed. And particularly if they intend to build a parallel system, they have to be willing to sacrifice (some of) the comforts of the existing society in order to achieve their goals.