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Thank you for your service, Elon (media.kotakuinaction2.win)
posted 4 years ago by dekachin 4 years ago by dekachin +79 / -0
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– dekachin [S] 7 points 4 years ago +7 / -0

This makes no sense, because there is a great amount of... diversity among the genes of different black populations. And even if we accepted all your assumptions, you would still be wrong, because Australian aboriginals unquestionably have a lower average IQ than any other group.

You can have "great diversity" in other areas but still share traits that cause low IQ. I mean, they obviously share the same genes to look black, so it's not like they're wildly different.

There are very good reasons why sub-Saharan Africa is a shitshow that have little to do with people being black. Same reason the inhabitants of the Canary Islands were at a Stone Age level when the Spanish encountered them: isolation.

Sub Saharan Africa was not isolated, and was huge in both size and population. Yet look at this map of IQ scores. FYI Mansa Musa was sub-saharan african and famously was the richest guy in the world & did a famous trip to the middle east. Africans traded and interacted with muslims and Islam spread throughout sub saharan Africa.

Later, european trade with west africa led to the slave trade, but that was still centuries ago.

IIRC, Blacks have better outcomes in the UK than do whites.

No, that's wrong. Blacks in the United States have better outcomes than blacks anywhere else in the world. I just looked up the UK stats. & Source You can see blacks really underperform whites. Indians and Chinese do better at the high end, but Chinese also cluster at the bottom, too.

Numerous IQ studies have proven that when you raise blacks in the US and other rich white countries with the same education whites get, the IQ gap persists. You can't put your assumptions about how things ought to work against the cold hard facts.

Same as black immigrants to your country. And of course, you can put all sorts of caveats on that - was the immigration a random sample? Probably not.

The obvious reason that Nigerian immigrants to the US do relatively well is because they aren't a random sample, they are cherry-picked elites. Slaves were a much more massive group, and whole tribes shipped over en masse. It wasn't like the African enslavers were giving all the captured people exams and then only selling the low scorers. And of course blacks living in Sub Saharan Africa NOW, the "winners" in the slave trade who did the enslaving instead of getting enslaved, score the worst in the world. Some of this is due to nurture factors, but even controlling for those factors, they are still at the bottom.

You need to reject the faulty premise that all human groups are totally equal. We simply know that isn't true. Some groups are taller than others. Some groups have advantages like superior lung capacity (tibetans, chilaens). And yes, some groups are smarter than others.

I think a lot of people refuse to accept this because "nazi eugenics" or whatever. I don't care. If Hitler said the world was round, I wouldn't because a flat earther just because of that.

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– AntonioOfVenice 2 points 4 years ago +2 / -0

You can have "great diversity" in other areas but still share traits that cause low IQ.

It's possible, but it's not something you can assume based on data from slave blacks who overwhelmingly came from West Africa, representing a tiny sliver of African DNA.

I mean, they obviously share the same genes to look black, so it's not like they're wildly different.

Clearly, you cannot know much about genetics, if this is the sort of stuff that you're going to say.

Yet look at this map of IQ scores.

I think these are based on guesses and calculations and not surveys in those specific countries. What I'm saying is not that there are no IQ differences between groups. Obviously, there are. Including within different groups of blacks, which is something you're denying.

FYI Mansa Musa was sub-saharan african and famously was the richest guy in the world & did a famous trip to the middle east. Africans traded and interacted with muslims and Islam spread throughout sub saharan Africa.

Do you normally precede stuff that everyone knows with an 'FYI'. The point is that a formidable barrier leads to more isolation than when there is not, and that this retards development.

I just looked up the UK stats.

You cite income data. I'm talking about educational outcomes. Which now comes to my mind, can be manipulated.

The obvious reason that Nigerian immigrants to the US do relatively well is because they aren't a random sample, they are cherry-picked elites.

Elite in no way guarantees high IQ. This is just your assumption. It's valid as a hypothesis, but you can't go around claiming that this is defintively true unless you provide some empircal evidence for it.

It may also be that Nigerians, particularly Ibos, have a different culture from black Americans that leads to better use of their intelligence rather than neglect. Or it might be that they are higher IQ than black Amereicans.

You need to reject the faulty premise that all human groups are totally equal.

I don't assume that. There is nothing in nature that guarantees that people will be equal in every respect, or that evolution has to stop at the neck. Still, any difference has to be demonstrated, not assumed. And I do often get the impression that you simply do not like blacks. I think you're literally the only one on the sub I had to ding for that.

I think a lot of people refuse to accept this because "nazi eugenics" or whatever. I don't care. If Hitler said the world was round, I wouldn't because a flat earther just because of that.

Group differences are real. The only question is whether these differences are genetic. It seems highly likely that they are, though there is also evidence against it - like the fact that Jews scored very poorly on IQ tests when they first arrived in the US, or differences between highland and lowland Scots who have the same genetics.

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